Advice needed On 18th edition boards. When do fit SPD boards?

Mr harrison · May 8, 2019

I’m
An NICEIC DI.
I haven’t got around to doing my 18th yet and I haven’t got the new literature.
How do you determine if you need to fit an SPD board.
Should I start fitting these on all my jobs now?

MJPD29 · May 8, 2019

Assess the need for it. Very rare in domestic households. I havnt fitted one yet to be honest there is absolutely no requirement to do so

Midwest · May 9, 2019

Not done the 18th, and currently not working as a spark.

However, I've read some posts on here about this subject, and I believe the regs suggest a risk assessment for SP in domestic dwellings; one bit of which is property value, around a few thousand pounds?

Telly's, fridge freezer, washing machine, etc etc, soon adds up. Not that I'm aware of being subjected to any 'surges'.

Wilko · May 9, 2019

Hi - for single domestic dwellings - I mention them to Customer and explain the benefits and the cost. I follow their direction and record on EIC. Some are happy to invest

.

Octopus · May 9, 2019

Don't worry about them ..............

Nigel · May 9, 2019

Still sparks giving false or bad advice on these.

SPDs can only be omitted in single dwellings ‘where the total value of the installation and equipment therein does not justify such protection’.

443.4 refers and uses the term ‘shall be installed’. Basically if the installation has electrical equipment over the value of about £200 BS 7671 states SPDs shall be installed.

Zerax · May 9, 2019

essex said:
Still sparks giving false or bad advice on these.

SPDs can only be omitted in single dwellings ‘where the total value of the installation and equipment therein does not justify such protection’.

443.4 refers and uses the term ‘shall be installed’. Basically if the installation has electrical equipment over the value of about £200 BS 7671 states SPDs shall be installed.

Errr... agreed... alot of bad advice...

443.4 actually says that there are 4 specific situations when you must fit an SPD (I won't type them out here, but this does not include my house).... OR you do a risk assessment... IF no risk assessment, you fit one anyway (i.e. you assume the highest risk)

So for my house, it's not one of the specific situations, so I've done a risk assessment and the 'Calculated Risk Level' is >1000... therefore No SPD is required.

Nigel · May 9, 2019

Zerax said:
Errr... agreed... alot of bad advice...

443.4 actually says that there are 4 specific situations when you must fit an SPD (I won't type them out here, but this does not include my house).... OR you do a risk assessment... IF no risk assessment, you fit one anyway (i.e. you assume the highest risk)

So for my house, it's not one of the specific situations, so I've done a risk assessment and the 'Calculated Risk Level' is >1000... therefore No SPD is required.

The risk assessment is not required for single dwellings so there really was no need to do one. This is clearly stated in 443.4 and then goes on to state what I have said above.

As I said. In a single dwelling there is no requirement to carry out a risk assessment and SPDs shall be installed of the value of electrical equipment is over about £200.

Can you show me your calculations please that say SPDs are not required on your dwelling?

Zerax · May 9, 2019

essex said:
The risk assessment is not required for single dwellings so there really was no need to do one. This is clearly stated in 443.4 and then goes on to state what I have said above.

As I said. In a single dwelling there is no requirement to carry out a risk assessment and SPDs shall be installed of the value of electrical equipment is over about £200.

Can you show me your calculations please that say SPDs are not required on your dwelling?

I think the issue is with the way that Paragraph 2 of 443.4 is read... you're correct in saying that there is no requirement to carry out a risk assessment... but, if you don't do one, then you should install SPD, unless it's a single dwelling and the value of any potential loss is small (your £200 figure)... if that makes sense.

As to the calculation... Example 4 on Page 106 of the 18th is exactly my situation... so it's all detailed there... This shows my CRL is 1,700 which is higher than 1,000 so no SPD is required.

HappyHippyDad · May 9, 2019

As you can see from above the answer is clear.
Maybe you should or shouldnt consider an SPD but probably not or perhaps sometimes, unless otherwise indicated.
As usual the regs are clear and transparent.
I can't see where the confusion lies?

Ian1981 · May 9, 2019

[ElectriciansForums.net] Advice needed On 18th edition boards. When do fit SPD boards?

This is Beama’s guidance on the matter taken from BSEN 60363-4-44
Certainly on the recent webinar I watched by the NICEIC and by my recent assessment, there does not seem a requirement to mandatory install one in a domestic dwelling in their eyes at least, but it should be advised to the customer the benefits of such protection.
Of course indent 1 loss of life could come under a domestic dwelling if there’s life affecting medical equipment located inside

Ian1981 · May 9, 2019

No CRL risk assessment required for domestic dwellings as also stated by bs7671

Strima · May 9, 2019

The cost of SPDs will get lower and get to such a point that their addition to an installation will become the norm.

Give your customers the details and let them make an informed decision.

Wilko · May 9, 2019

deleted

Andy78 · May 9, 2019

Strima said:
The cost of SPDs will get lower and get to such a point that their addition to an installation will become the norm.

Give your customers the details and let them make an informed decision.

They are already pretty cheap. SBS has them listed at £20 on his
current price list.

AJshep · May 9, 2019

I generally install them in dwellings, I do give the customers the choice though, but honestly though if you tell them there have been rumours of insurance companys are using surges to get out of paying for damaged electrical equipment they usually just tell you to put them in.

If they dont want it, just get them to sign a letter, just take a copy and attach it to your EIC.

Risteard · May 9, 2019

essex said:
443.4 refers and uses the term ‘shall be installed’. Basically if the installation has electrical equipment over the value of about £200 BS 7671 states SPDs shall be installed.

To paraphrase (without getting BS7671 out for exact wording), the requirement is essentially that where the value of equipment warrants it an SPD should be fitted. (This would require discussion with the Client.) It does not necessarily mean that where the value of the equipment exceeds the cost of installing an SPD that it must be done. I don't believe that is what is intended by the wording.

Risteard · May 9, 2019

essex said:
443.4 refers and uses the term ‘shall be installed’. Basically if the installation has electrical equipment over the value of about £200 BS 7671 states SPDs shall be installed.

To paraphrase (without getting BS7671 out for exact wording), the requirement is essentially that where the value of equipment warrants it an SPD should be fitted. (This would require discussion with the Client.) It does not necessarily mean that where the value of the equipment exceeds the cost of installing an SPD that it must be done. I don't believe that is what is intended by the wording.

Baddegg · May 9, 2019

The value of anything can only be decided by the owner of it surely.....

Wilko · May 10, 2019

Baddegg said:
The value of anything can only be decided by the owner of it surely.....

Don’t start me, what with your fancy common sense and all ...

GMDemo · May 21, 2019

I spoke to the NAPIT inspector today about this issue and he suggested that on a dwelling if it is overhead cable or has a lightening conductor you should insist on fitting SPDs otherwise offer it to the customer and if they refuse the extra cost just write it up on the cert.
BTW I'm new here though, unfortunately, I'm not new to the electrical industry and have had my own business for 34 years. I passed my 18th edition way back in august with 92% and I received the same advise on the course.
I'm just in the process of changing registration from the NIC to NAPIT and it's doing my crust in.

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