Electric boilers - how is this going to work.

Selfmade · May 14, 2019

? Thinking ahead a wee bit here, it looks like lots of people will be switching from gas combi boilers to electric combi boilers over the coming years. Most of the electric boilers seem to be around 12kW, while most of the gas boilers I've seen even in flats and small houses seem to be 30kW plus. So my main question is, how is replacing a 30kW + boiler with a 12kW boiler going to be sufficient to heat the place?

Secondly, what to do about about max demand? Many old domestic properties have 60A or even lower cut-outs, so how does that work with a ~50A boiler? Do we have to get the DNO to upgrade (in my past experience they are very reluctant to do so). And what about other large loads like showers? Do we have to fit some kind of selector switch so only one can be used at a time?

Tony Reidy · May 15, 2019

Selfmade said:
? Thinking ahead a wee bit here, it looks like lots of people will be switching from gas combi boilers to electric combi boilers over the coming years. Most of the electric boilers seem to be around 12kW, while most of the gas boilers I've seen even in flats and small houses seem to be 30kW plus. So my main question is, how is replacing a 30kW + boiler with a 12kW boiler going to be sufficient to heat the place?

Secondly, what to do about about max demand? Many old domestic properties have 60A or even lower cut-outs, so how does that work with a ~50A boiler? Do we have to get the DNO to upgrade (in my past experience they are very reluctant to do so). And what about other large loads like showers? Do we have to fit some kind of selector switch so only one can be used at a time?

I have fitted a few the idea is to use them on economy 10 and not at peak time ok in a well insolated home

Tony Reidy · May 15, 2019

Selfmade said:
? Thinking ahead a wee bit here, it looks like lots of people will be switching from gas combi boilers to electric combi boilers over the coming years. Most of the electric boilers seem to be around 12kW, while most of the gas boilers I've seen even in flats and small houses seem to be 30kW plus. So my main question is, how is replacing a 30kW + boiler with a 12kW boiler going to be sufficient to heat the place?

Secondly, what to do about about max demand? Many old domestic properties have 60A or even lower cut-outs, so how does that work with a ~50A boiler? Do we have to get the DNO to upgrade (in my past experience they are very reluctant to do so). And what about other large loads like showers? Do we have to fit some kind of selector switch so only one can be used at a time?

I have fitted a few the idea is to use them on economy 10 and not at peak time ok in a well insolated home

Tony Reidy said:
I have fitted a few the idea is to use them on economy 10 and not at peak time ok in a well insolated home

Insulated

Tony Reidy · May 15, 2019

Selfmade said:
? Thinking ahead a wee bit here, it looks like lots of people will be switching from gas combi boilers to electric combi boilers over the coming years. Most of the electric boilers seem to be around 12kW, while most of the gas boilers I've seen even in flats and small houses seem to be 30kW plus. So my main question is, how is replacing a 30kW + boiler with a 12kW boiler going to be sufficient to heat the place?

Secondly, what to do about about max demand? Many old domestic properties have 60A or even lower cut-outs, so how does that work with a ~50A boiler? Do we have to get the DNO to upgrade (in my past experience they are very reluctant to do so). And what about other large loads like showers? Do we have to fit some kind of selector switch so only one can be used at a time?

Just get a blanket

Charlie_ · May 16, 2019

Isle of Man headline news

[ElectriciansForums.net] Electric boilers - how is this going to work.

GeorgeCooke · May 16, 2019

Very short sighted. How does the I of M generate its electricity?

StephenRowley · May 16, 2019

It won't happen it's one of those pie in the sky dreams, that the government won't invest the money to actually to Amie it happen. Most DNO networks are running at max load anyway.

Midwest · May 16, 2019

As I mentioned before, someone else bought this up in another thread, think it was this link;

The Clean Growth Plan: A "2050-ready" new-build homes policy - https://www.energysavingtrust.org.uk/clean-growth-plan-2050-ready-new-build-homes-policy

a-z electrics · May 18, 2019

Solar panels, battery and an iboost to heat hot water virtually for free..

snowhead · May 18, 2019

a-z electrics said:
Solar panels, battery and an iboost to heat hot water virtually for free..

That assumes your house roof faces the Sun or is not shadowed by trees or other buildings. And that you don't have clouds above your house for several days at a time.
And nothing is (virtually) free, especially solar panels, inverters and batteries.

Trevor Scruton · May 18, 2019

One of the larger users of liquid fuel and gas are the motor trade. They have dabbled with hydrogen as an alternative fuel. As we all know, the exhaust from a hydrogen system or motor is warm water. The biggest problems with hydrogen atm is how cheaply it can be produced to compete with what's available, also the transmission of it. could the existing gas network be used?

Zerax · May 18, 2019

Trevor Scruton said:
...The biggest problems with hydrogen atm is how cheaply it can be produced to compete with what's available, also the transmission of it. could the existing gas network be used?

Most of our gas network (I can't vouch for recent stuff) was designed for 'Town Gas' which is has alot of hydrogen in it... so in theory, it should be an easy transition back to what we used to have ?

Simon47 · May 18, 2019

Selfmade said:
Most of the electric boilers seem to be around 12kW, while most of the gas boilers I've seen even in flats and small houses seem to be 30kW plus. So my main question is, how is replacing a 30kW + boiler with a 12kW boiler going to be sufficient to heat the place?

Probably no problem for the heating - but the hot water supply will be on the carp side of rubbish. One of the problems with (gas) combi boilers is that they are generally vastly over-sized for the heating load - and thus suffer from not condensing due to the fudges (eg bypass) required to make them function at all with a typical existing heating system. They have to be vastly over-sized because if they are sized appropriately to the heating load - then they'll be incapable of supplying decent hot water.
Example: 1990s one bed flat, ground floor with another flat above it. Combi installed has minimum output power of about 9kW, hot water output rating of nearly 30kW (but still struggles to fill the bath faster than it's going cold). So how much heat does the flat need for heating ? About 2kW average when outside it's been hitting -10˚C or lower and struggling to get above freezing during the day. I measured it by using the immersion on the thermal store for heating, letting it settle for a couple of days, and then seeing how much lecky it used for a couple of days - back in Dec 2010 when we had that long cold spell and the flat was empty.

LightGEN · May 19, 2019

Noting some early comments in this thread about connection sizes ....I see that the REA has called for three phase to become the norm for domestic connections ....mostly driven by the need for EV charging.
Homes should be fitted with three-phase electricity supply - Utility Week - https://utilityweek.co.uk/new-homes-fitted-three-phase/

Zerax · May 19, 2019

LightGEN said:
Noting some early comments in this thread about connection sizes ....I see that the REA has called for three phase to become the norm for domestic connections ....mostly driven by the need for EV charging.
Homes should be fitted with three-phase electricity supply - Utility Week - https://utilityweek.co.uk/new-homes-fitted-three-phase/

I'd love to see the Government's grand plan for sourcing all this extra power whilst sticking to greenhouse gas targets ! And all this whilst keeping the cost increases low enough to avoid riots on the streets...

LightGEN · May 20, 2019

Zerax said:
I'd love to see the Government's grand plan for sourcing all this extra power whilst sticking to greenhouse gas targets ! And all this whilst keeping the cost increases low enough to avoid riots on the streets...

Clearly, this isn't going to happen over-night. The cost of 'renewable' energy generation is ever decreasing; the strike price for recent off-shore wind farms (£57.50/MWh) is vastly less than that of the propose Hinkley Point nuclear plant (£92.50/MWh - in 2012 prices)
On the other side of the equation, individual consumption has dropped significantly with increases in efficiency.
Among the interesting proposals I see is the idea of constructing geothermal power plants in Iceland to supply the UK via underwater cables ....a couple of companies are investigating projects of this type. Tidal lagoons have potential; the Swansea Bay project seems to have found some investors and that may now go ahead ....that's a pilot project to prove the concept, with potential for a number of larger projects.

Electric boilers - how is this going to work.

Selfmade

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Tony Reidy

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Tony Reidy

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Tony Reidy

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Charlie_

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GeorgeCooke

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StephenRowley

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Midwest

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a-z electrics

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snowhead

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Trevor Scruton

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Zerax

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Simon47

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LightGEN

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Zerax

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LightGEN

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