Knightsbridge GU10 Fire-rated fittings - Loose push connectors - anyone else?

Mark42 · Sep 25, 2019

Today I'm retro-fitting 21 x Knightsbridge mains GU10 VFRDGIC fittings.

They have what looked like time-saving push connectors, similar to Wagos.

But the xxxxxxx things don't work! They have two-gang connectors (2xE 2xL 2xN) but when I insert two 1.0 T&E legs into each they don't grip well.

The stripped legs are long enough, and yes, they are both the same CSA.

When closing the lid - and that's when you can get it to latch properly (!) - at least one of the conductors comes loose. As the earth is looped, that's no good: I have no confidence in the system.

Has anyone else found this problem? Are they just rubbish connectors, or have I missed something?

[ElectriciansForums.net] Knightsbridge GU10 Fire-rated fittings - Loose push connectors - anyone else?

Midwest · Sep 25, 2019

They don't look a very good design, there's not enough room for the stripped cables to be terminated. It then puts a strain on the push in terminals. I would strip back the cable some more, so the 'wires' are less acute into each terminal, if you follow, more like a dog leg into each terminal.

littlespark · Sep 25, 2019

There are other LED fittings with the same problem. Some fluorescent fittings have them too.
Agree with what Midwest suggests....
Bend the L & N so they enter the connections parallel with the cpc. You might need to cut the cpc a tad shorter

westward10 · Sep 25, 2019

I had this a while back ended up using a piece of flex into Click Flow connectors.

Andy78 · Sep 25, 2019

Having dealt with garbage fittings such as these before I would suggest both the above responses give the answer. More of a square bend on the cables and trim the cpc shorter to compensate for the bend on the others.
Knightsbridge stuff is pretty low budget low quality gear in general.

westward10 · Sep 25, 2019

By the time you have fluffed around and cursed getting conductors the exact length you could have put a piece of flex in and wired a Click Flow connector. If you persist in trying to wire the cables direct the constant worry will be poor connections.

Midwest · Sep 25, 2019

westward10 said:
By the time you have fluffed around and cursed getting conductors the exact length you could have put a piece of flex in and wired a Click Flow connector. If you persist in trying to wire the cables direct the constant worry will be poor connections.

I’d perceive a bit; could be done and remove the need for additional terminations.

littlespark · Sep 25, 2019

yes. carry on until you get the knack.
cores have to be pushed straight in, and use a fresh stripped cable.... cores that have been previously twisted together don't go in right.
When theyre in properly, they should pull out easily without pushing down the tab.... and closing the lid grips the outer sheath further

Mark42 · Sep 25, 2019

Thank you, gentlemen, for all the advice.
I found that removing more of the outer sheath and having the inner cores enter the connector more perpendicularly, made them a LITTLE less likely to pull out. But it's a cr@p job having singles hanging out of the fitting, then covering them with tape.
I thought about a bit of flex then Wagos in a Wagobox, but I don't have enough boxes here, the shops are shut, and I need to finish this tonight and leave. Not happy about it.
At least it's all LEDs now, so little heat and only about 40mA per fitting so there's no fire risk from any poor terminations.
At eight quid each I'd have expected more. I'm puzzled how such rubbish connectors can be compliant. I won't buy this brand again!

GBDamo · Sep 25, 2019

MarkRibbands said:
Today I'm retro-fitting 21 x Knightsbridge mains GU10 VFRDGIC fittings.

They have what looked like time-saving push connectors, similar to Wagos.

But the xxxxxxx things don't work! They have two-gang connectors (2xE 2xL 2xN) but when I insert two 1.0 T&E legs into each they don't grip well.

The stripped legs are long enough, and yes, they are both the same CSA.

When closing the lid - and that's when you can get it to latch properly (!) - at least one of the conductors comes loose. As the earth is looped, that's no good: I have no confidence in the system.

Has anyone else found this problem? Are they just rubbish connectors, or have I missed something?

View attachment 52546
View attachment 52547

Seen loads of these, they're a cheap generic Chindian component that finds its way into a lot of kit.

Some are better than others but if i hit, even the slightest, loss of confidence I use only one port using flex and use three way wagos to make the rest of the connection.

Not going to work in that tiny enclosure mind.

Pretty Mouth · Sep 25, 2019

Same problem I had with some enlite efd pros a while back, same piano key connector, earth terminals wouldn't grip. If you looked into the terminal holes you could see which ones were going to be a problem. I swapped the connectors for wago 224s.

westward10 · Sep 25, 2019

Wrapping in tape doesn't sound like a solution.

Andy78 · Sep 25, 2019

MarkRibbands said:
Thank you, gentlemen, for all the advice.
I found that removing more of the outer sheath and having the inner cores enter the connector more perpendicularly, made them a LITTLE less likely to pull out. But it's a cr@p job having singles hanging out of the fitting, then covering them with tape.
I thought about a bit of flex then Wagos in a Wagobox, but I don't have enough boxes here, the shops are shut, and I need to finish this tonight and leave. Not happy about it.
At least it's all LEDs now, so little heat and only about 40mA per fitting so there's no fire risk from any poor terminations.
At eight quid each I'd have expected more. I'm puzzled how such rubbish connectors can be compliant. I won't buy this brand again!

You shouldn't be having basic insulation outside the enclosure. I don't think the connector is at fault, but rather the lack of space in the box.

For only £12 you could have got the KSR QR10 integrated fittings I use with plenty room at the push fit terminals, or even the Enlite E8 which seems very popular.

Mark42 · Sep 25, 2019

As stated above, with experience it gets better. After a break at a local bar: a gin Martini, a poncy avocado and quinoa salad (yeah, but this site is in SW1) and things start to look and feel better.
Still bloody awful but there's a work-around: form the cores a little tighter, insert them, hold in place, fix with a well-tight cable tie having discarded the useless clamp and hairpin arrangement. This prevents the cores from dislodging, even if they are not very well clamped.
No loose cores, no tape, and enough to get the job finished tonight, even if I have to do the first few again. It's going to be a late night, but I'm a night owl anyway

Andy78 · Sep 25, 2019

Everything's better after a martini. Just remember to not use those fittings again. It's the tiny little things that can end up giving such big headaches.

Knightsbridge GU10 Fire-rated fittings - Loose push connectors - anyone else?

Mark42

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Midwest

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littlespark

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westward10

Andy78

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westward10

Midwest

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littlespark

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Mark42

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GBDamo

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Pretty Mouth

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westward10

Andy78

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Mark42

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Andy78

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