Bathroom pull cords

Dartlec · Mar 22, 2021

Would be interested to know how people would code this:

Upstairs bathroom - with pull cord and shower switch above 2.25 (just)... but over the edge of the bath below shower. Not in a location where they are likely to be sprayed with water unless someone is really trying...

6mm cable to shower running down directly between tiles and cold feed to shower.

Shower is RCD protected, but bathroom lighting circuit currently isn't - (that's already a C2 which will be fixed with RCBO on that circuit).

The Cable not separated from 'non-electrical services' seems like a C3 to me, since it's RCD protected.

Switches are clearly not in a good location - and I feel I should note that, but not sure they reach a C2 level.

Seen some discussion on here years ago about the cords, but the shower cord does actually have that plastic 'piece' in, which I believe is meant to provide some insulation from a wet cord scenario? The upper bit probably does fall within Zone 2 by mm....

[ElectriciansForums.net] Bathroom pull cords

loz2754 · Mar 22, 2021

Switches not in zones - no code.
Cable touching a cold pipe - no code.
No RCD to lights - C3.

Deleted account · Mar 23, 2021

Agree with @loz2754 other than the lights.

I would C2 lights of no supplementary bonding.

mattg4321 · Mar 23, 2021

Lights are C3 if supplementary bonding in place

C2 if not.

Dustydazzler · Mar 23, 2021

Depending on type of light C3 or C2 , if 12v downlights C3 , if a batton holder C2

littlespark · Mar 23, 2021

For the layout of bathroom, the bathtub has always been there, the lighting pull cord has always been there. Assume wired to regulation at the time.
C3 at worst, but check for bonding.

Dartlec · Mar 23, 2021

loz2754 said:
Switches not in zones - no code.
Cable touching a cold pipe - no code.
No RCD to lights - C3.

I've C2 for the light (not shown) with no RCD because it's a one of the metal type with glass cover held on with 3 thumb screws. Fine IP rating wise, but the earth wasn't even connected from the ceiling supply either.

Resolved that on the day, but as there is no supplementary bonding I'd consider it a C2 based on the Best Practise Guide.

It's an MK board so I can fortunately replace with an RCBO to solve that problem. It might be possible to supplementary bond in the loft, but that would probably end up costing more than a straight RCBO switch.

I did give the client the option of switching the lights onto the existing RCD side of the board, but explained the downsides and they've gone the RCBO route.

The only issue I have with not coding things is that it's later hard to tell whether they were even considered or just missed - I do like to add comment only for some things (Smoke alarms for example) where they don't fit a C3 guidance but should really be done - even if it is only when things are next changed/refurbed.

With the cable/cold pipe - would you tick the inspection schedule 5.16: Cables segregated/separated from non-electrical services (528.3) to show a pass, or LIM it? 528.3.4 isn't very clear about what suitable "protection against hazards likely to arise" actually means.

Deleted account · Mar 23, 2021

Dartlec said:
I've C2 for the light (not shown) with no RCD because it's a one of the metal type with glass cover held on with 3 thumb screws. Fine IP rating wise, but the earth wasn't even connected from the ceiling supply either.

Resolved that on the day, but as there is no supplementary bonding I'd consider it a C2 based on the Best Practise Guide.

It's an MK board so I can fortunately replace with an RCBO to solve that problem. It might be possible to supplementary bond in the loft, but that would probably end up costing more than a straight RCBO switch.

I did give the client the option of switching the lights onto the existing RCD side of the board, but explained the downsides and they've gone the RCBO route.

The only issue I have with not coding things is that it's later hard to tell whether they were even considered or just missed - I do like to add comment only for some things (Smoke alarms for example) where they don't fit a C3 guidance but should really be done - even if it is only when things are next changed/refurbed.

With the cable/cold pipe - would you tick the inspection schedule 5.16: Cables segregated/separated from non-electrical services (528.3) to show a pass, or LIM it? 528.3.4 isn't very clear about what suitable "protection against hazards likely to arise" actually means.

Things like this you mention.

I always but C1 C2 C3 FI and another (Observation only).

observations section is there for observations they do not necessarily have to have a code.

It can be lack of or out of date smoke detectors.No RCD protection, not enough sockets. Abundance of extension leads and adaptors.

use the observation page for observations. It doesn’t affect the outcome of report but shows your diligence.

loz2754 · Mar 23, 2021

I totally agree with C2 for no supplementary bonding and no RCD protection.
I too would recommend putting a note for things that don't comply but pose no danger. But no codes.

old man sparky · Mar 28, 2021

Judging by the stickers on the shower cover, kiddies use the area.
Pullcord under excessive stress the way its angled across the shower rail bar.
So before long that switch will start to stiffen up and get harder to operate.
The class 2 cord connector will break and the owner or tenant will tie a not in it which brings another scenario into play. The switch continues to get worse and eventually pulls the shower bar down onto a kids head, which in itself could cause injury. So IMHO the lighting pull cord gets a code 2 needs to be moved.
EICRs are judgement calls. Sometimes you need to take noses out the book and see a potential hazard based on what you know occurs in situations from past experience.
If you can see a potential danger regs or no regs code or no code. Let em know about it.
Devils advocate yes. Am I over the top ?? Nope because I have seen it happen. ?

westward10 · Mar 28, 2021

That plastic part on the string has nothing to do with Class II insulation it is for changing the string. Here is an old metal MK one on mine.

loz2754 · Mar 28, 2021

old man sparky said:
Judging by the stickers on the shower cover, kiddies use the area.
Pullcord under excessive stress the way its angled across the shower rail bar.
So before long that switch will start to stiffen up and get harder to operate.
The class 2 cord connector will break and the owner or tenant will tie a not in it which brings another scenario into play. The switch continues to get worse and eventually pulls the shower bar down onto a kids head, which in itself could cause injury. So IMHO the lighting pull cord gets a code 2 needs to be moved.
EICRs are judgement calls. Sometimes you need to take noses out the book and see a potential hazard based on what you know occurs in situations from past experience.
If you can see a potential danger regs or no regs code or no code. Let em know about it.
Devils advocate yes. Am I over the top ?? Nope because I have seen it happen. ?

As you say. It's the responsibility of the inspector on site to make their own judgement.

old man sparky · Mar 28, 2021

westward10 said:
That plastic part on the string has nothing to do with Class II insulation it is for changing the string. Here is an old metal MK one on mine.View attachment 83918

Yep its total nonsense !! ? Devils advocate ?

telectrix · Mar 28, 2021

shower pullcords are spawn of the devil. unless it's a crabby or click 50A, it wants binning.

old man sparky · Mar 28, 2021

telectrix said:
shower pullcords are spawn of the devil. unless it's a crabby or click 50A, it wants binning.

Especially when the Ruddy things are used like switches rather than for isolation only. And being so close to the shower itself more chance of being used under load conditions. Hang on !! Do we see another reason to code coming on ?

Bathroom pull cords

Dartlec

loz2754

Deleted account

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mattg4321

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Dustydazzler

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littlespark

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Dartlec

Deleted account

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loz2754

old man sparky

westward10

loz2754

old man sparky

telectrix

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old man sparky

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