2330 Advice

[Bri Watt]

Hi guys, I've seen similar threads regarding C&G 2330, I am looking for some advice specific to me, and was wondering if you could help me.

I work as a general handyman, among the many none electrical jobs I do, I've also replaced socket-outlets, control switches and ceiling roses.

Wanting to be able to carry out more indepth electrical work i.e. shower and cooker installations, adding to circuits and being unable to get work signed via a regulating body; I studied for and passed my City & Guilds 2330 NVQ Level 2 and my 17th Edition Wiring Regulations.

I am currently studying City & Guilds 2330 Technical Certificate Level 3.
2330 level 2 was great but after 3 or 4 months of level 3 I feel I have learnt nothing, or nothing that helps me.
Alot of (all of) the course seems to be theory to industrial and commercial, and Health and Safety on building sites etc.
All I'm after is something that will help me with the work I do/may do in peoples homes.

I contacted Niceic; they said as I've already got the 17th Edition I could get assessed and become an Niceic Domestic Installer.

Now I'm thinking of leaving my 2330 level 3 as I've gained nothing so far this school year, and saving my cash to get the test equipment required and pay Niceic fees for competent assessment etc.
A friend wants me to rewire their house in the summer, so I think that will probably be the best thing for me to be assessed on and will give me time enough to save for fee's.

I'm just wondering;
- am I shooting myself in the foot dropping out of 2330?
- does anyone know what the domestic assessment consists of?

Any advice greatly appreciated.
Brian

 

[pushrod]

Hi, I am currently studying 2330 level 3 as well and must admit that the pace of it at the start was pretty slow, also the option we are studying along side of it (alarms) has been very slow to get going. However more recently things have improved and i can feel that we are doing stuff that is going to be useful.
For you i would think a major consideration is how old you are - if you have 10 -15 years plus of your working life left i would definitely not pack it in. As i understand it, you can't become a proper electrician without it and you won't be able to progress beyond being a domestic installer. Ten years from now you may well kick yourself if you can't progress any further into commercial work or writing PIRs especially as you are halfway there already.
That's my 2Ps worth anyway - hope its relevant

 

[LlandrilloSpark]

Hi mate,Dont quit your Level 3, It is a great qualification to have, and it is being disbanded and replaced with the new 2357 diploma this year so you wont be able to complete it.

You say you feel you have learned nothing?, from the sept-feb period of my level 3 I couldnt beleive how much i learned!!, the level 2 is really kids stuff, but by the end of level 3 you really feel like you are on your way to becoming an electrician(in theory).

 

[Bri Watt]

@pushrod
TBH, I don't want to get into the commercial side of things.
I'm just wanting it as part of my handyman business, ie cookers, additions to circuits and showers.
I'm thinking i can do that by getting assessed by Niceic.
Thanks for getting back to me though.

Hi mate,Dont quit your Level 3, It is a great qualification to have, and it is being disbanded and replaced with the new 2357 diploma this year so you wont be able to complete it.

You say you feel you have learned nothing?, from the sept-feb period of my level 3 I couldnt beleive how much i learned!!, the level 2 is really kids stuff, but by the end of level 3 you really feel like you are on your way to becoming an electrician(in theory).

You might be going to a better college than me. haha
I do worry that the 2330 is getting stopped soon and that I may kick myself in the future

 

[peterbay]

Advice level three will give you an electricains status. (not to be dismissed). the course is aim a general electrics so there will some commerical aspects.But having completed level 2 go on and finish level 3. get 2392 and then you will able to do all domestic work. College can be slow the main learning goes on at work and later.

Best of luck

 

[pushrod]

Hi mate,Dont quit your Level 3, It is a great qualification to have, and it is being disbanded and replaced with the new 2357 diploma this year so you wont be able to complete it.
.

good point i remember we were told that a few weeks ago.

Brian even if you don't fancy the commercial side of things you won't be able to get into domestic inspection and testing without the full 2330 plus you will always be tied to competent person's schemes (£400 a year at the moment isn't it?)

When you are 55+ the thought of earning money by doing a few inspections , instead of crawling through loft spaces might be a bit more appealing
Well i have tried ...

 

[Bri Watt]

good point i remember we were told that a few weeks ago.

Brian even if you don't fancy the commercial side of things you won't be able to get into domestic inspection and testing without the full 2330 plus you will always be tied to competent person's schemes (£400 a year at the moment isn't it?)

When you are 55+ the thought of earning money by doing a few inspections , instead of crawling through loft spaces might be a bit more appealing
Well i have tried ...

I think my college may be an issue here.
It seems to be all handouts.


Would 2391 or 2392 be an alternative option do you think? Or would it be useless without 2330?
Just exploring all avenues lol

 

[pushrod]

I think my college may be an issue here.
It seems to be all handouts.


Would 2391 or 2392 be an alternative option do you think? Or would it be useless without 2330?
Just exploring all avenues lol

I learn quite a bit from reading on here and answering when i can.

With regards to 2391 i don't think they would let you do one without the 2330 and i think that is the important one - i think the 2392 is just a stepping stone to it ( if i have got them the right way around). I am hoping to do it as i reckon it will give you a few more options and also help a lot more than the 2330 with fault finding.

regards.

 

[LlandrilloSpark]

I may get shot down in flames for this but I find the whole "Domestic Installer" thing a total joke, You spend 2-3 years working hard at college doing your 2330 level 2 and 3, you come out of it with a real good insight and you "feel" like an electrician, you can work in commercial and industrial (with your 2382 17th), and you can rewire a 4 bed semi wit a new CDU.

Or you can be a Mcdonalds employee one minute then do your EAL dommesic installer scheme in 6 weeks and then go rewire a 4 bed semi with CDU ......wrong

I work at our college in the elec department and have spoken to students who have done these courses and even they say they dont know what they are doing and dont feel safe.

 

[Bri Watt]

I may get shot down in flames for this but I find the whole "Domestic Installer" thing a total joke, You spend 2-3 years working hard at college doing your 2330 level 2 and 3, you come out of it with a real good insight and you "feel" like an electrician, you can work in commercial and industrial (with your 2382 17th), and you can rewire a 4 bed semi wit a new CDU.

Or you can be a Mcdonalds employee one minute then do your EAL dommesic installer scheme in 6 weeks and then go rewire a 4 bed semi with CDU ......wrong

I work at our college in the elec department and have spoken to students who have done these courses and even they say they dont know what they are doing and dont feel safe.

So with the aim to be doing Domestic self employed, my best avenue is to complete my 2330 level 3, I already have my 17th, then register with Niceic?

Will I need to do the competency scheme if I have 2330?

If I do still need to the competency scheme is 2391 the way i can cert work?

 

[LlandrilloSpark]

No you can self certify with the 2392 which is the easier of the inspection and testing quals, the competent persons scheme is just a way of saving the hassle notifying the local authorities every time you do notifiable work in a domestic dwelling, they do it for you, vouch for you.

 

[Bri Watt]

No you can self certify with the 2392 which is the easier of the inspection and testing quals, the competent persons scheme is just a way of saving the hassle notifying the local authorities every time you do notifiable work in a domestic dwelling, they do it for you, vouch for you.

That sounds good, I'd heard its easier than 2391.
How often do you need to be assessed for the competent person scheme?

Thanks for the advice by the way

 

[pushrod]

No you can self certify with the 2392 which is the easier of the inspection and testing quals, the competent persons scheme is just a way of saving the hassle notifying the local authorities every time you do notifiable work in a domestic dwelling, they do it for you, vouch for you.

Do you know what sort of cost is involved (ball park figures) when you notify local building control yourself ?


Brian - if you are in a competent persons scheme you have to pay and be assessed every year

 

[LlandrilloSpark]

Approx £100+ v.a.t , so u can see the benefit of paying niceic, elecsa or napit £400 a year!
being involved in the college i get to speak to lots of sparks, a lot self employed and some who work for bigger firms and do foreigners, Im being straight with you when i tell you less than 10% ever notify, the attitude is tell the customer its £100 per visit, tell them they have to pay and then the decision is theirs.

Problem is that at the end of the day it all comes down to money,competition and winning jobs, imagine you are installing a few fcu's and sockets in a new kitchen, that is notifiable work, if you charged £200 to do the job then another £117 for the labc visit then thats £317, your fellow electrician, your main rival decides not to notify and gives the customer the choice and then does the job £25 less(maybe he has stock left over), then his price for the same job is £175, you can bet which one they choose.

 

[pushrod]

Approx £100+ v.a.t , so u can see the benefit of paying niceic, elecsa or napit £400 a year!
being involved in the college i get to speak to lots of sparks, a lot self employed and some who work for bigger firms and do foreigners, Im being straight with you when i tell you less than 10% ever notify, the attitude is tell the customer its £100 per visit, tell them they have to pay and then the decision is theirs.

Problem is that at the end of the day it all comes down to money,competition and winning jobs, imagine you are installing a few fcu's and sockets in a new kitchen, that is notifiable work, if you charged £200 to do the job then another £117 for the labc visit then thats £317, your fellow electrician, your main rival decides not to notify and gives the customer the choice and then does the job £25 less(maybe he has stock left over), then his price for the same job is £175, you can bet which one they choose.

Is it legal if you do that ? I assume they still give the customer the correct EIC, etc ?

I have heard of well qualified electricians approaching their LABC themselves showing them all their qualifications and then the LABC agree to accept their work without a visit and then just charge a nominal fee for paper work. Does that sound possible?

It seems ridiculous that a very well qualified, time served spark should constantly have their work visited, while a 6 week domestic installer is turned loose with just one yearly check from some supervisor who basically wants their membership money