Another EICR RCD question

[John777]

Hi All.

Sorry for not introducing myself and asking a question on my firs post, but I have been losing sleep lately...

An electrician went into flat and did EICR. Would not give a copy until I paid up front and now says I need a new fuse box etc £850 + worth of work. My flat is tenanted and in excellent condition. It was built about 20 years ago. The wiring looks safe enough to me (I'm not an electrician tho!) but there is no RCD.

I am lead to believe that it doesn't need to be changed, since no new circuits have been added.

I attach EICR and photo of fuse box

Any advice would be appreciated

 

[telectrix]

RCD for sockets for outside use would be a C2. otherwise a C3, but upgrading the CU would be beneficial.

 

[Darkwood]

@John777

I have removed the certificate you posted as you left all the contractors details on the cert' if you wish to post these reports please ensure all information is fully redacted that can identify the address and contractor.
I would like if you fully redact the info' as opposed to partially doing so like address etc.

 

[Julie.]

On a personal view, I agree with Tel, I would say C3 for lack of RCD, however in general more and more would venture towards C2 these days.

As for the third C2, it would depend on the size of the shower, this could be above 32A but below the cable limit, as it's a fixed load the MCB does not have to provide overload protection so the 40A MCB could be fine as it is.

In saying all the above, replacing the consumer units would be a worthwhile investment.

 

[ipf]

Looks like it was done pretty decently. A look inside and at the main incomer and tails would be interesting. Might be a fair job for someone decent. You never know, though.

 

[westward10]

All those Crabtree SB6000 16 and 20A mcbs are gold dust on the second hand market.

 

[buzzlightyear]

All those Crabtree SB6000 16 and 20A mcbs are gold dust on the second hand market

has about rear has chicken teeth.

 

[John777]

Hi All.

Sorry for not introducing myself and asking a question on my firs post, but I have been losing sleep lately...

An electrician went into flat and did EICR. Would not give a copy until I paid up front and now says I need a new fuse box etc £850 + worth of work. My flat is tenanted and in excellent condition. It was built about 20 years ago. The wiring looks safe enough to me (I'm not an electrician tho!) but there is no RCD.

I am lead to believe that it doesn't need to be changed, since no new circuits have been added.

I attach EICR and photo of fuse boxView attachment 84342

Any advice would be appreciated

 

[John777]

I've uploaded the EICR with all details removed and pic of the bus bars

 

[westward10]

To be honest I'm surprised most of those C3s were not C2. What level of the building is the flat located on.

 

[Julie.]

To be honest I'm surprised most of those C3s were not C2. What level of the building is the flat located on.

Agree, however without seeing the actual job it is difficult to judge, the FCU in Zone 1 could be a left-over from a heater 2.2m high - I would agree with C3, as realistically there is no issue; if it was next to the bath however then C2 any day.

There are a number of significant errors with the report though - it's shown as C2 for RCDs provided for fault protection - it isn't a TT all circuits appear to have suitable fault protection - so what is this about??? There is a C3 for adequacy of fault protection, yet nothing in the observations regarding inadequacy of fault protection, there is a C2 for lack of overload protection on a shower (which isn't actually needed on a fixed load anyway) and so on.

Not a good example of a periodic inspection, but exceedingly common unfortunately.

 

[westward10]

I agree they state TN-C-S but the Inspection Schedule states all the first part as LIM which to me indicates the main intake was not accessed, overall that Schedule is not good. Open continuity of ring final circuit conductors I will always C2, overheating at shower switch the same and open connectors at the HW pump would have to see but sounds to me a C2.

 

[Sparks82]

I also noticed he stated no rcd protection at the board and also ticked rcd protection for lights and cables buried in wall in the schedule

 

[Dartlec]

As already mentioned this is one of those cases where although there are several errors on the schedule, it may well still end up having at least one C2 and a new consumer unit may well end up being the best (or only) way to resolve it.

Whether that justifies a quote of £850+ is a separate point, and I'd certainly recommend getting another quote if at all possible. All RCBO board(s) may be reasonable at that price, while a dual RCD would not IMO.

Some of the errors on the schedule are fairly common (The RCD for fault protection should be N/A but seems to be a very common error).

The main issue that might require a new CU is the lack of RCD to sockets. But the form filling is confusing at best.

5.12 has N/A for mobile equipment for use outdoors, which suggests this might be a higher storey flat? If so, then most of the guidance suggests that lack of RCD for socket circuit is a C3, not a C2.

This may be one where NAPIT strikes again? Though if it where I'd expect there to be a C2 for no RCD on cables <50mm, and instead that is ticked, as is the box for RCD protection for luminaires!

There is also an FI on the schedule for (I assume) the fused spur in the bathroom, but this is given a C3 on the observations - and the only FI there is for grommets missing from back boxes, which is usually not mentioned, or a C3 at worst unless there is actual visible cable damage.

No sure why 4.8 - 'manual operation of circuit breakers and RCDs' is a C2 either, unless one of the breakers didn't isolate, in which case that should be noted as an observation.

Likewise not sure what 'open connectors' for hot water pump means? No earth continuity? Is it a class 1 pump? Presumably if it's working then it has a L and N connection...

It's pretty clear that those IR tests are made up too - almost no chance that they were able to isolate everything on those circuits to get a L/N reading that high.

However, issues with the report aside, Just from what I'm seeing, this is an installation that might be just on either side of 'satisfactory' depending on personal judgement, (if the individual minor issues were fixed), but an installation that will need a new CU in the not too distant future regardless.

So in terms of advice to the OP, although you might be able to find an electrician who would give this installation a satisfactory, it's also possible that someone could do a perfect report and still reasonably find it unsatisfactory.

It may be worth discussing with other electricians and getting them to quote for remedials based on this report, as I think you might be able to get lower than £850. (I don't know what Oxford rates are like though).