code 1 or code 2

[Dean Williams]

Hi
at the theatre i'm currently testing there are a dozen or so instances where a 30A BS88 fuse is protecting a 1.5mm conductor, given that the cables are all in steel conduit, the regs state max current carrying capacity 17.5A. is this a code 1?
surely, should a fault develop, then the 1.5 will burn out before the fuse goes pop, effectively its like sticking a nail in instead of a fuse!

so surely it must be a code 1.

thanks

 

[telectrix]

i'd be more inclined towards a code 2, as there is no real and immediate danger.

 

[Dean Williams]

but surely its a fire risk

 

[kent0570]

Electrical safety council best practice guide states circuit with ineffective overcurrent protection is a code 1 defect

 

[pushrod]

Agree that it is a real problem there but in my limited knowledge as Tel says there should be real and immediate danger ie already existing, like an exposed live part for it to be coded as 1. Code 2 is for a potential danger, albeit a large one in this case.

edit : good call kent - certainly needs sorting quickly whatever code it gets.

 

[telectrix]

that fuse will still break before the cable gets hot enough to be a fire danger though.

 

[telectrix]

another grey area here then. having said that, if it were me, i'd replace the fuse with a 15A anyway , for what it costs.

 

[kent0570]

just wondering when was this theatre last tested and how may times has this fault been picked up and reported, only to be ignored by the customer!

 

[Blowcat]

The company I work for now sugest a code 1 for all over rated devices.
A previous company would have given it a code 2 but if the circuit could get over loaded due to the type of circuit / number of point or sockets then they wanted us to give it a code 1.

As always there are 2 ways to asess the situation.

 

[Deleted member 9648]

If the circuit cables are overloaded and that is why a 30a fuse is fitted then I'd give it a 1.....if not I'd code it 2. Either way the PIR will get an 'unsatisfactory'.

 

[Sintra]

It could be that the circuits comply to reg 433.3.1(ii) regarding ommision of devices for protection against overload.

 

[Blowcat]

Before the 17th edition when a code 2 could get a satisfactory, it was more important to get your code 1 + 2's spot on but now the cert comes back unsatisfactory with a code 2 on it so dont see the need to stress out over it. Its going to fail.

 

[moorman84]

This is a CODE 1 all day every day. Dont let anybody tell you any different. The only ommisions are for eg motor circuits that are also protected by overload trip or VSD's which has overload protection built in.

 

[telectrix]

It's probably been like that for years, so how can there be a real and immediate danger?

 

[Deleted member 9648]

Tel is spot on.....if the 1.5mm cable is seriously overloaded that may be a real and immediate danger and be worth a code 1.....if it's not then there is only likely to be a problem in the event of a fault,and even that is only a possibility not a probability,a real and immediate danger? No way.