Difficulty in getting my head around the logistics of a rewire and retaining power?

[HappyHippyDad]

I am quoting for my first full rewire and I am am having difficulty trying to get my head around the logistics of retaining power/lights for the client whilst the re-wire is taking place?

It will take me around 2 weeks (working by myself) and the main point is that the CU is going to be moved to another room. This will be a lived-in rewire so I have to retain a portion of the power/lighting for the client throughout the re-wire. Just wondering how you usually do this with a re-wire?

How do you keep power/lights for the client if you are running new cables down to a socket/lights as you will be removing the old cables, and the new cables will be running to a different starting location (without power) due to the CU being moved.

This must be a common occurrence so was hoping for some ideas on how you guys do it?

Cheers.

 

[Octopus]

Re: Difficulty in getting my head around the logistics of a rewire and retaining powe

I never do live in rewires so its never a problem.

 

[Aurai]

Re: Difficulty in getting my head around the logistics of a rewire and retaining powe

One thought

get a feed from a next door neighbour?

 

[Andy78]

Re: Difficulty in getting my head around the logistics of a rewire and retaining powe

I am quoting for my first full rewire and I am am having difficulty trying to get my head around the logistics of retaining power/lights for the client whilst the re-wire is taking place?

It will take me around 2 weeks (working by myself) and the main point is that the CU is going to be moved to another room. This will be a lived-in rewire so I have to retain a portion of the power/lighting for the client throughout the re-wire. Just wondering how you usually do this with a re-wire?

How do you keep power/lights for the client if you are running new cables down to a socket/lights as you will be removing the old cables, and the new cables will be running to a different starting location (without power) due to the CU being moved.

This must be a common occurrence so was hoping for some ideas on how you guys do it?

Cheers.

first off you need to persuade them to go on holiday while you do the rewire. If this fails then......
The answer is that there is no simple answer and will be different depending on each property. You need to:

• Agree with the customer the level to which power and lights will be expected to be on at the end of any given day/time period, including possible temp supplies.
• Agree on furniture shifting, who will be doing this as this can easily take 1-2 hours of a day. If it's you then your quote and schedule needs to reflect this.
• Agree on which rooms will be available on which days and stick to the schedule. Both you and the customer.
• Work room by room and not bite off more than you can chew in a day.
• Stay as long as it takes to achieve what has been agreed in a given day.
• Get a second hand in to help. So much easier and may prevent you from having to lift as many boards for access.

 

[telectrix]

Re: Difficulty in getting my head around the logistics of a rewire and retaining powe

a few ways to do it.

1. rip out old CU and fit a temp. RCD/MCB 1 way CU with couple of twin sockets. extension leads and some plug-in lights to manage.

2. do the new install with all new gear, not in the exact location of the existing, while keeping the existing installation running. then disconnect old installation when you do CU change on last day.

3. rewire and 2nd fix each circuit 1 at a time. connect into old CU till you done them all.

 

[Dave OCD]

Re: Difficulty in getting my head around the logistics of a rewire and retaining powe

I think it's a case of the customer having to compromise a bit too, for example they might have to do without the cooker for one night, maybe some lights another night, but if you rig up a couple of double sockets as temporary supplies it's easy to run extension leads for important stuff like fridge/freezers, the phone and most crucially the kettle. Also you'll probably have to connect,test and energise one circuit at a time into the new CU rather than all at once.
Try to plan it so you can complete 'stages' each day and not be going back round rooms several times too, you'll manage fine.

 

[Dave OCD]

Re: Difficulty in getting my head around the logistics of a rewire and retaining powe

a few ways to do it.

1. rip out old CU and fit a temp. RCD/MCB 1 way CU with couple of twin sockets. extension leads and some plug-in lights to manage.

2. do the new install with all new gear, not in the exact location of the existing, while keeping the existing installation running. then disconnect old installation when you do CU change on last day.

3. rewire and 2nd fix each circuit 1 at a time. connect into old CU till you done them all.

The voice of experience. :smile5:

 

[7029 dave]

Re: Difficulty in getting my head around the logistics of a rewire and retaining powe

Hi Steve, you could depending on the type of situation, you say the CU is being re sited, if no sub main is included, just split the tails at there origin, block them with henley's and have both CU's live, so when you start on an circuit, kill old. Rewire and connect into new once happy with dead tests . etc.

 

[GMES]

Re: Difficulty in getting my head around the logistics of a rewire and retaining powe

Andy 78 has it right for me get them to go away, even knock some off the bill to get rid of them just imagine the time it is going to take to make the site safe every night, floorboards down etc.

 

[davesparks]

Re: Difficulty in getting my head around the logistics of a rewire and retaining powe

The way I was taught as an apprentice was to start at the top and work down reconnecting to existing feeds until you get to the CU. This generally resulted in large coils of T&E being left under the floor connected to the existing feeds waiting to be run into the next room the next day or to the CU.
This way we never left any lights or power off overnight.

If the CU is moving then for ring circuits you could just leave a loop of cable where the new cu is going, leave one of the new sockets off with JBs on the tails to connect to the existing legs.
Lighting circuits run the feed from the new CU position with its end capped off and just join the old feed into the circuit at any convenient point and disconnect once the changeover is done.

The other option is to have the new CU fitted and live then just run the new circuits out from there. Leave the old circuits live feeding the rooms you haven't got to yet. You might want to put the rings on 20A MCBs until you have completed the whole new circuit so that you can leave it as two branches of a radial and not have to temporarily complete the ring each night.

 

[davesparks]

Re: Difficulty in getting my head around the logistics of a rewire and retaining powe

Andy 78 has it right for me get them to go away, even knock some off the bill to get rid of them just imagine the time it is going to take to make the site safe every night, floorboards down etc.

It's not much of a hardship to put floorboards etc back each night.
If you plan the work properly and don't mind finishing a couple of hours late occasionally then you only have to lift floors in each room once or twice.

 

[7029 dave]

Re: Difficulty in getting my head around the logistics of a rewire and retaining powe

IMO, occupied rewires is an skill that this trade is loosing very fast, it is probably the most I used to do when contracting, nobody seems to want to do it, or have an clue where to start.!

 

[VoltzElectrical]

Re: Difficulty in getting my head around the logistics of a rewire and retaining powe

Without seeing it???? I guess you will have to use your imagination and some extension leads.

Sorry, started tying then phone went off! Agree with above posts. Good luck, got start somewhere!

 

[davesparks]

Re: Difficulty in getting my head around the logistics of a rewire and retaining powe

IMO, occupied rewires is an skill that this trade is loosing very fast, it is probably the most I used to do when contracting, nobody seems to want to do it, or have an clue where to start.!

We did a few when I was an apprentice.

To be honest I was shocked when I left the company and first encountered the idea that some people turn the house off and expect people to live with a few temporary sockets while it's happening!

 

[Dave OCD]

Re: Difficulty in getting my head around the logistics of a rewire and retaining powe

We did a few when I was an apprentice.

To be honest I was shocked when I left the company and first encountered the idea that some people turn the house off and expect people to live with a few temporary sockets while it's happening!

Surely that's no biggie, if some spoilt kid can't use his Xbox or whatever for a few days perhaps he'll do something useful instead ? [Unlikely though] And I'm sure most people would rather have a little inconvenience than pay £100s more just to have everything working every evening.

 

[davesparks]

Re: Difficulty in getting my head around the logistics of a rewire and retaining powe

Surely that's no biggie, if some spoilt kid can't use his Xbox or whatever for a few days perhaps he'll do something useful instead ? [Unlikely though] And I'm sure most people would rather have a little inconvenience than pay £100s more just to have everything working every evening.

It's the sheer lack of basic respect for the customer and their property that I don't like.

 

[Dave OCD]

Re: Difficulty in getting my head around the logistics of a rewire and retaining powe

No that's not what I mean Dave, all my customers are treated with the utmost respect and courtesy but I'd also explain that if they were happy to tolerate a few small inconveniences during a rewire then the job would take at least a day less to complete and they would save some money, just giving them the options.

 

[PEG]

Re: Difficulty in getting my head around the logistics of a rewire and retaining powe

At least, a basic plan of attack,should be considered at pre-quote time,at which point,discussion of expectations can occur.

I may have skimmed the original post,but en extra pair of hands is too beneficial to ignore.

Always remember,two heads are better than one...even if they're sheeps' heads :smartass:

 

[HappyHippyDad]

Re: Difficulty in getting my head around the logistics of a rewire and retaining powe

Thanks all for those replies. There are some really good ideas and I'll think about which may be best for this situation.

Hopefully I will be able to persuade them to move out for the 2 weeks, I'll offer a reduction in the quote as an incentive as I would MUCH prefer it to be unoccupied!

 

[HappyHippyDad]

Re: Difficulty in getting my head around the logistics of a rewire and retaining powe

At least, a basic plan of attack,should be considered at pre-quote time,at which point,discussion of expectations can occur.

I may have skimmed the original post,but en extra pair of hands is too beneficial to ignore.

Always remember,two heads are better than one...even if they're sheeps' heads :smartass:

This is not something I have considered but you're right. What is the going rate to pay someone to give you a hand? I dont mean another electrician or even an electricians mate, just a helper with taking up the floorboards, taking out all the old cable, channelling etc etc? My local builder pays his helper £60 p/day and I've always thought that was pretty low, although perhaps its the going rate?

 

[ImpededLoop]

Re: Difficulty in getting my head around the logistics of a rewire and retaining powe

I may have skimmed the original post,but en extra pair of hands is too beneficial to ignore.

Always remember,two heads are better than one...even if they're sheeps' heads :smartass:

Great advice.... I once rewired a bungalow singlehandedly and vowed never to again. An extra pair of hands will make the job 3x quicker through not trudging back and forth, getting in and out the loft etc. etc.

It's also more fun to work with someone else and you usually learn something too.

 

[ImpededLoop]

Re: Difficulty in getting my head around the logistics of a rewire and retaining powe

This is not something I have considered but you're right. What is the going rate to pay someone to give you a hand? I dont mean another electrician or even an electricians mate, just a helper with taking up the floorboards, taking out all the old cable, channelling etc etc? My local builder pays his helper £60 p/day and I've always thought that was pretty low, although perhaps its the going rate?

I'd get an electrician to help. The day rate is higher than a labourer, but the work done will be much greater too and you won't need to be helping them every two minutes.

 

[davesparks]

Re: Difficulty in getting my head around the logistics of a rewire and retaining powe

This is not something I have considered but you're right. What is the going rate to pay someone to give you a hand? I dont mean another electrician or even an electricians mate, just a helper with taking up the floorboards, taking out all the old cable, channelling etc etc? My local builder pays his helper £60 p/day and I've always thought that was pretty low, although perhaps its the going rate?

Lifting floorboards without damaging them is a job which requires a degree of skill.
Generally most of the old cables come out as you use them to pull the new ones in, or just leave then where they are if you can't get them out.
And there is usually very little chasing to be done as you often have existing conduits to use.

 

[conrad]

Re: Difficulty in getting my head around the logistics of a rewire and retaining powe

Its not difficult just a little more time consuming... Only problem i see is the cu being in a different location. Is the supply in for that? If so its just a case of switching over a cicuit at a time.

 

[7029 dave]

Re: Difficulty in getting my head around the logistics of a rewire and retaining powe

As said, do not waste your time on trying to pull out all the old cable. If it don't budge leave it, of course if your pulling through on old then fine and an bonus.

 

[GMES]

Re: Difficulty in getting my head around the logistics of a rewire and retaining powe

I agree with getting some help even if it is just labour getting from one floor to the next and loft work will be so much quicker plus you will be out of the place a lot faster. You can be the nicest guy alive but believe me they will be sick of the sight of you after a week let alone 2 weeks.

 

[Leesparkykent]

Re: Difficulty in getting my head around the logistics of a rewire and retaining powe

I've done rewires on my tod in the past...what a drag! In and out of lofts etc where as if you had a helper he could just pass you what you need.

 

[GMES]

Re: Difficulty in getting my head around the logistics of a rewire and retaining powe

Also what about approaching a trainee from the forum to help out, he is going to be more use than a standard labourer and also should be an affordable option for you Steve.

 

[Jonboy1989]

Re: Difficulty in getting my head around the logistics of a rewire and retaining powe

I live in Bristol and work a 4 on 4 off shift rota, would happily help you out for free if you could teach me a little as you go along. Will happily give as much time as I can on my days off that I have nothing planned. Pre warning though, I am VERY green.

 

[PEG]

Re: Difficulty in getting my head around the logistics of a rewire and retaining powe

^ Agree...Even a reliable youth,can pay dividends,to have about,and could save fortunes,by simply uttering "where's this water coming from?" or "...the tip of yer drill is showing..." or even the classic,"...i just heard a bang,in that meter cupboard..." :tounge_smile:

The idea of giving a trainee a week or two,is another commendable option...they would benefit from experience,impossible to replicate,in the classroom.

...My sheeps' heads comment,is one i use regularly,and has proved correct on many occasions.

I have had mates of mine,coming out on jobs,so we can catch up,have a bit of dinner,etc,and they may be a dentist,or horse dealer,but when they say "should that be loose,like that?" and i reply, "Mmm,that will need attention..." then,they have assisted.

When i go to see them,and maybe its' a farrier pal,and i say "...should that lump be red?",and he replies "mmm,this needs a vet,not shoeing..." then,i have assisted.

Us humans are not solitary beasts,for a reason....even if it's just to have a good argument,on a forum...:rofl:

 

[DPG]

Re: Difficulty in getting my head around the logistics of a rewire and retaining powe

Lifting floorboards without damaging them is a job which requires a degree of skill.
Generally most of the old cables come out as you use them to pull the new ones in, or just leave then where they are if you can't get them out.
And there is usually very little chasing to be done as you often have existing conduits to use.

Very good point that. Hate seeing butchered floorboards. Daz

 

[telectrix]

Re: Difficulty in getting my head around the logistics of a rewire and retaining powe

Very good point that. Hate seeing butchered floorboards. Daz

you need to work where no plumber has gone before.

 

[High Tower]

Re: Difficulty in getting my head around the logistics of a rewire and retaining powe

The 2 most pertinent points in this discussion for me are:

1, rewires on your own are a PITA!, look at getting help!, i dont do domestic, but i did a house rewire about 2 years back, 4 of us did it in a little over a weekend with me there Monday second fixing the DB and testing and a bit of tidying up on the Tuesday morning, it was a big 4 bed too!

2, try and get them to move out, bu adding more labour to the job you can get it done a damn sight quicker, thus reducuing the length of time you are asking them to move out for, the example above, the clients boarded their dog in a doggy hotel and booked themselves in for a filthy weekend in a posh hotel!. doesent half make things a lot easier!

 

[Midwest]

Re: Difficulty in getting my head around the logistics of a rewire and retaining powe

Yep, and get them to take their furniture with them, including the grand piano, theatrical wardrobe hangers & Victorian Chester draws.