Does this warrant bringing the installers back to make it right?

[jerriais]

Got a call from a local guy that we quoted for, he went with another company and has now asked me to inspect his install today to see how it was. I've now done that and found a few issues:

1 Only used 12 hooks on a row of 7 panels (no wind calcs provided as far as I know but this is quite a few less than our calcs have ever come up with)
2 Cables left dangling on roof between every panel so they'll suffer from abrasion each time the wind blows them.
3 Tile removed where each hook is placed, bottom is flashed with sticky-backed lead replacement but still a gap around the hook for wind-driven snow or rain to penetrate.

Because the scaffolding is coming down tomorrow he's now asked me to give an opinion on whether to ask them to put these issues right before they take it down. My gut feeling is that I would want it put right but then that's just because it falls well short of the standard that we install to. What are thoughts on the forum about his legal right to ask them to correct these issues as his system is producing normally and his roof is not leaking?

 

[ArseyDee]

The guy chose not to give you the install work, but now wants your professional opinion? That's a bit cheeky!

 

[solarsavings]

I think that the people who have the brass neck to go with a cheaper quote and then ask the more professional company to come and inspect the work they've had done should............................................

 

[SolarCity]

When you say 12 roof hooks, do you mean 12 per rail? Or 6 per rail? We normally install 7-8 on a 7 metre run.

The roof hook solution looks very poor and I would say that this is the main issue with the install.

 

[JulianC]

Take payment for your inspection, report your findings and leave. What he choses to do with his installers is his business.

 

[jerriais]

I don't really feel that way (about the first two replies). A large part of our work these days is carrying out diagnosis and repair work for badly installed systems. I charge my time for repair work or producing an inspection and I'm upfront with the customer about that so it doesn't bother me whether it's a customer who's had a quote from us or not. I'm just more concerned with trying to encourage a PV industry that has healthy competition among installers who know how to put panels on roofs properly so they'll stay there a long time.

 

[jerriais]

When you say 12 roof hooks, do you mean 12 per rail? Or 6 per rail? We normally install 7-8 on a 7 metre run.

The roof hook solution looks very poor and I would say that this is the main issue with the install.

Only 6 per rail, the least we've ever put is 8 per rail of 7 panels, but sometimes more depending on location.

 

[solarsavings]

If you're happy to get paid for reporting any faults don't you think they ought to be your opinions and not members of the forum. I wouldn't have the cheek, but hey ho it takes all sorts.

 

[ArseyDee]

I don't really feel that way (about the first two replies). A large part of our work these days is carrying out diagnosis and repair work for badly installed systems. I charge my time for repair work or producing an inspection and I'm upfront with the customer about that so it doesn't bother me whether it's a customer who's had a quote from us or not. I'm just more concerned with trying to encourage a PV industry that has healthy competition among installers who know how to put panels on roofs properly so they'll stay there a long time.

Fair enough.

That's a worrying statement though. What percentage would you say is poor countrywide?

 

[jerriais]

If you're happy to get paid for reporting any faults don't you think they ought to be your opinions and not members of the forum. I wouldn't have the cheek, but hey ho it takes all sorts.

It's just more objective to get the views of other installers and show that it's not just me who find this kind of work unsatisfactory. I'm not asking the forum members to find the faults that will go in my report, just their opinions as to whether the faults are serious enough to get the installer to rectify them.

 

[Silly Sausage]

Fair enough.

That's a worrying statement though. What percentage would you say is poor countrywide?

Says to me that he's feeding off poor installers!
If the OP is that concerned, as he pointed out earlier, shouldn't he be employing differing methods in order to improve the industry?

Re the install: how long are those cables going to last chaffing against those roof tiles?

 

[whinmoor]

We would use at least 7 hooks, probably 8 or 9 on each rail. Ideally there would be a hook under each panel.

 

[jason121]

Just done a quick calc with K2 they recommend 8 roof hooks with 8 panels

 

[D Skelton]

Without wanting to go into any detail about the PV aspect of the job, at the very least those cables should be secured to meet regs (I haven't got my BGB to hand but there is definitly a requirement within it to ensure cables are secure), If there is a real risk of abrasion or damage occuring to a cable as a result of it's poor installation, the installer is liable to put it right. Both the EAWRs and the Building Regulations call for good workmanship, of course this is subjective, but I can't see many people agreeing that cables loosly strung across a roof is an example of good workmanship.

As for the tiles removed, I can't really comment as I can't see it in my own eyes, but it would worry me that driving rain could easily penetrate as a result. Maybe consulting with a decent roofer would help in your assessment of whether or not their solution is adequate enough to provide good protection from the elements.

If I'm inspecting another electricians work and there are obvious corners cut that affect the safety of an installation, hands down every time I would be advising the client to have the other electrician return to rectify his shoddy and potentially dangerous work!

Put it this way, if you had me round at your gaff to install some outside lights for example and I left the feed for them just loosley strung across the roof and for the hell of it decided to just whip a few roof tiles off, you'd be calling me back round to sort it out I'm guessing!

 

[jerriais]

Says to me that he's feeding off poor installers!

We get customers calling us up on a fairly regular basis and asking us to fix issues with inverters, roof hooks, isolators etc. Usually it's after they have called their original installer but they've now gone bust (often because they were pricing jobs too low to make a sustainable business) We then assess what needs doing, tell the customer how much it will cost then either they choose to go with us or not. How is that feeding off poor installers? (FYI some of the very worst installers have probably become very rich because it's a lot cheaper to install badly with poor quality kit)

If the OP is that concerned, as he pointed out earlier, shouldn't he be employing differing methods in order to improve the industry?

I'm sure there are various ways to improve the industry, I could go and work for RECC or MCS :yesnod:, take out newspaper ads warning people how not to choose a cowboy installer, but I choose to try to educate customers that I meet as to what are the things to look out for to make sure their install will last a long time and not compromise their safety or the watertightness of their roof.

Re the install: how long are those cables going to last chaffing against those roof tiles?

Exactly!