ECS card arggggghhhhhhhh.

[AJshep]

So I formally completed and finished my electrotechnical apprenticeship with JTL in 2003.
My apprenticeship was a standard five year and we only got entered into doing our AM2 once we had completed 5 years experience and shown neccessary experience in our log books. In this time I completed the various courses...
C&G Part 1 & 2 (236 I believe) AM1, AM2 and NVQ levels 2 & 3 (which were log book based)
Once I completed I got a nice certificate from JTL, and headed signed letters which also had JIB mark on it saying I've completed a formal apprenticeship in the electrotechnical industry and it listed all my quals. I also got a nice letter from JTL congratulating me and saying I've left funded training and my training contract was sent back to me.

Anyway I never applied for my card back then, my logic was I'll do my 2391 then get a "approved" card. So a few years later that's what I did, but unfortunately I never got around to applying for my card either and to be honest I never needed it.

Anyway now 15 years later, I want my card. My qualifications have been checked and verified, however I'm getting placed on hold because ECS think I'm still an Apprentice, they won't except my completion certificate, they won't except my my formal letters from JTL they won't except my original training contract from JTL because it says training deeds on the top .
The only thing they will except is a JIB409 form, the trouble is I no longer have contact with the company I completed my apprenticeship with back in 2003.

When I rang them up the woman said " I can see you have completed, but we can only accept an original training contract or a JIB409".

I work for myself now, I've tried sending copys off to JTL but I never get anything back. A few months this has been going on now.

Surely it can't be this hard, does everyone have this issue.

 

[The Ghost]

SNAFU

 

[westward10]

These people are a nightmare to deal with. I do not understand their stance if you have provided qualification evidence, they really do operate a computer says no system.

 

[Ian1981]

If you have provided proof of your technical certificates level 2&3 and an NVQ level 3 certificate in electrical installation or maintenance if that’s applicable to you then that is all you need.
I’ve never sent in my apprenticeship deeds as I didn’t think to and I find it irrelevant, my proof of qualifications was all that was needed

 

[Toneyz]

Are you trying to get the gold ECS for going onto sites if so as Ian posted you have got all the quals and, to be honest, site managers don't really look at them just take a photocopy.

 

[AJshep]

If you have provided proof of your technical certificates level 2&3 and an NVQ level 3 certificate in electrical installation or maintenance if that’s applicable to you then that is all you need.
I’ve never sent in my apprenticeship deeds as I didn’t think to and I find it irrelevant, my proof of qualifications was all that was needed

There is no issue for me actually getting the gold card, with the "Apprroved grading" however on this new online portal the ECS have now I have to provide a written statement saying that I wish to gain my card without having completed an apprenticeship.

The woman on the phone said my Gold Card will mention that I've not completed an apprenticeship if I go this route.

##
The reason I want my card is one day I want to get my technician card later on in life and I need an Approved card for at least 4 years before applying for a technician card even if I have all the qualifications.

 

[AJshep]

To make it more clear see the picture below.

 

[Ian1981]

If it’s causing such an issue I’d just sack the apprenticeship bit off.
You can still have an approved card or technicians card.
All that will be missing on the back of the card with the list of qualifications are the words ‘ completed apprenticeship ‘

My card is an approved electrician card and the jib do not have my apprenticeship details on file.
Maybe I’ll send them in when I do the 18th edition or maybe I can’t be chewed with the online hassle of it all.

 

[AJshep]

Yeah your right Ian1981.
I'm just a bit stubborn, and I'll probably end up doing that and although it is pretty minor detail it's the more the princple.
In my eyes we all had to go through our apprenticeships so I or anyone else shouldn't have to lie and say I didn't complete one, when I did.

I'm going to carry on chasing up JTL for a little longer.
I'll let everyone know the outcome.

 

[Gavin John Hyde]

If you are registered with the niceic as an approved contractor, then if you have been the QS for the company for 3 years you can get a goldcard for £35+VAT via the NICEIC...
not sure if that helps but I know somebody who got one and pretty much bypassed the usual route apart from uploading his picture and doing the health and safety course as certsure/niceic dealt with it all.
Supporting contractors in the building services sector | NICEIC - http://www.niceic.com/goldcard
as always with NICEIC it appears the qualifications element is perhaps a bit more relaxed... as it allows for equivalent certificates reflecting nvq outcomes!? If you got your NVQ and 2391 then you can get one for £35+VAT which if i recall is cheaper than direct with the ecs online site.

 

[AJshep]

I'd thought I'd come and update.

After a few attempts I finally got a response from JTL and received a signature on this JIB409 form.
The JIB now recognize that I completed my apprenticeship back in 2003 and I've got my virtual "Approved" gold card.

I saw this extra section in which the holder can opt-in for being listed as a registered electrican, you have to agree to a statement to say that your work safely and to a professional standard and keep up to date with the wiring regulations.

I ticked the box, as I read they were going to make this compulsory in the future, not that I suppose it makes any difference

 

[elsparko]

join unite and get them to sort it on your behalf lol

 

[Deleted member 26818]

My JIB card is very important to me, as without it I would not be able to work.
Although I sent copies of my 2360 and my 16th when I first obtained the card, all it shows on the back is my more recent 17th.
The MyECS site lists my 2360 and 16th, but it says there is no record of when I passed them.
As such although I have a gold card which states Installation Electrician, I have no JIB grade. Looks like I got my gold card with just the 17th.
A while back, I thought to get member of the IET added, but after waiting an age I cancelled the request as my card was due for renewal.
The renewal process is a bit Pot luck, had it take a couple of days, a few weeks and one time over three months.
When you need it quick it takes forever, when there’s no rush, it comes really quick.

 

[westward10]

Took me five months to get my renewal last year because they could not receive or send emails because my Broadband is with BT, I kid you not. The times I have managed to converse over the phone I get the impression of one person in a bedroom surrounded by piles of forms and not coping.

 

[Deleted member 26818]

Still don’t understand why they now have the option to have Registered on the card.

 

[Ian1981]

I’ve just renewed my card and have the registered electrician status on it however my understanding is that I will lose the registered status if I don’t achieve the 18th edition by July 2019.
I’ll still retain approved electrician status but my virtual card won’t say registered.
Even tho my physical card says registered if that makes sense
Or will they request I cut it up and not keep it haha

 

[Ian1981]

My JIB card is very important to me, as without it I would not be able to work.
Although I sent copies of my 2360 and my 16th when I first obtained the card, all it shows on the back is my more recent 17th.
The MyECS site lists my 2360 and 16th, but it says there is no record of when I passed them.
As such although I have a gold card which states Installation Electrician, I have no JIB grade. Looks like I got my gold card with just the 17th.
A while back, I thought to get member of the IET added, but after waiting an age I cancelled the request as my card was due for renewal.
The renewal process is a bit Pot luck, had it take a couple of days, a few weeks and one time over three months.
When you need it quick it takes forever, when there’s no rush, it comes really quick.

The only technical qualifications shown on your cards are your nvq3 (2360 level 2&3 form part of this qualification), any testing and inspection qualifications and the most upto date edition of the wiring regulations.
Pat testing and the 2396 and additional qualifications.
When I filled out an application on paper it tells you what actual qualifications will appear on your card.

 

[Toneyz]

Although all intentions were probably good at the start this is, unfortunately, turning into a scam who is policing this? when you go on site managers don't really look at it just take a photocopy to be fair to them with all the trades they have how do they know regarding all the quals. I also bet that a lot of employers aren't bothered if you have not got it "it's your problem" they don't stop sending you to site if your card expires most wouldn't even keep a record. O God Im'e starting to rant like Pete!
P.S. So far I have had no problem with ECS card/renewal & calling them.

 

[Deleted member 109422]

Interesting posts, thanks

 

[Nolan1977]

Hi I’m having trouble with getting “Completed Apprenticeship” on back of my card although I’m graded as an “Installation Technical”.

I finished my apprenticeship in 1998. I didn’t ever remember receiving a JIB409 did they even exist then ? No idea where my training deeds are either. Did anyone finish their apprenticeship in 1998 or around that time and get a JIB 409 ?

 

[AJshep]

Hi I’m having trouble with getting “Completed Apprenticeship” on back of my card although I’m graded as an “Installation Technical”.

I finished my apprenticeship in 1998. I didn’t ever remember receiving a JIB409 did they even exist then ? No idea where my training deeds are either. Did anyone finish their apprenticeship in 1998 or around that time and get a JIB 409 ?

You wouldn't have.. I had the same but I did get a certificate stating I completed my apprenticeship but the JIB wouldn't accept it.
I had to email my old training provider (JTL) a form and someone there signed it and emailed it back to me.
Apparently you could get your old firm who you trained with to sign it too if they are still around.

 

[Nolan1977]

Thanks so much. No wonder I can’t find one.

What form do I need to send to JTL. I emailed them last night asking if they had any record of me

 

[AJshep]

It's ECS own form you can download it on their website basically it's just a blank form I emailed this over to someone at JTL, they signed stamped and signed it and sent it back.

Its a complete PITA as i had a letter headed letter and a certificate from JTL congratualating me on completing my apprenticeship and stating that I'd left funded training.

if you send me a pm on here I'll see if i can hunt out the form. It was back in 2018 but sure I'll have on my PC somewhere

Thanks so much. No wonder I can’t find one.

What form do I need to send to JTL. I emailed them last night asking if they had any record of me

 

[Chaz_smith]

So I formally completed and finished my electrotechnical apprenticeship with JTL in 2003.
My apprenticeship was a standard five year and we only got entered into doing our AM2 once we had completed 5 years experience and shown neccessary experience in our log books. In this time I completed the various courses...
C&G Part 1 & 2 (236 I believe) AM1, AM2 and NVQ levels 2 & 3 (which were log book based)
Once I completed I got a nice certificate from JTL, and headed signed letters which also had JIB mark on it saying I've completed a formal apprenticeship in the electrotechnical industry and it listed all my quals. I also got a nice letter from JTL congratulating me and saying I've left funded training and my training contract was sent back to me.

Anyway I never applied for my card back then, my logic was I'll do my 2391 then get a "approved" card. So a few years later that's what I did, but unfortunately I never got around to applying for my card either and to be honest I never needed it.

Anyway now 15 years later, I want my card. My qualifications have been checked and verified, however I'm getting placed on hold because ECS think I'm still an Apprentice, they won't except my completion certificate, they won't except my my formal letters from JTL they won't except my original training contract from JTL because it says training deeds on the top .
The only thing they will except is a JIB409 form, the trouble is I no longer have contact with the company I completed my apprenticeship with back in 2003.

When I rang them up the woman said " I can see you have completed, but we can only accept an original training contract or a JIB409".

I work for myself now, I've tried sending copys off to JTL but I never get anything back. A few months this has been going on now.

Surely it can't be this hard, does everyone have this issue.

hi , did you get anywhere with this , i have had an absolute nightmare with these people ?

 

[Chaz_smith]

Has anyone found a way around this ? I've been trying to gain a gold card on behalf for my Dad. (family business ) . He had a gold card through the NICEIC but it expired ! The whole thing is an absolute ---- take and money making scam! He has had over 40 years experience and forgotten more than i know .! He runs his own company and has given so much to the trade over the years and employment for others , only to be told by someone who has no clue what's going on that he can't have a gold card . We have all his original certs and they've been kept immaculate but we don't have the apprenticeship deeds and the firm stopped trading in 1986 . They are saying he needs NVQ level 3 its a bloody joke ! Surely he hasn't now got to pay close to £2000 for an experienced worker assessment !!?? I can't seem to find anyone else really kicking off about this !! would have thought people would be up in arms over it ! any info would be very welcome . thanks

 

[westward10]

Why does he need one.

 

[Chaz_smith]

Why does he need one.

Because its required on contract we have , but yes that's exactly what he said !! (with a few added swear words in the sentence !!!)

 

[MJPD29]

It is a money making scheme, I've never applied for a card, and never will. Only do hazardous area work and have never even heard one mentioned. Its a real shame your contract is demanding them, because they really are a load of crap.

 

[Chaz_smith]

It is a money making scheme, I've never applied for a card, and never will. Only do hazardous area work and have never even heard one mentioned. Its a real shame your contract is demanding them, because they really are a load of crap.

Yeh massive money making scheme! Unfortunately of the proper big building sites won’t even let you on site without one . Obviously it’s not a problem if it’s just domestic work .

 

[MJPD29]

Strange, I do zero domestic work and spent a huge amount of time on large building sites but never heard one mentioned. Is this just the norm now?

 

[I'mAvillen]

Hi I’m having trouble with getting “Completed Apprenticeship” on back of my card although I’m graded as an “Installation Technical”.

I finished my apprenticeship in 1998. I didn’t ever remember receiving a JIB409 did they even exist then ? No idea where my training deeds are either. Did anyone finish their apprenticeship in 1998 or around that time and get a JIB 409 ?

Hi Nolan, I'm guessing but i think they only have your technical qualifications, site experience cert's are missing. Maybe also AM2. Anyway, who wants to be an electrician? Biggest ripoff game in the world! You name me a trade where you get a book that keeps renewing over and over again? And, then have to pay an arm and a leg to complete a course related to that book.

 

[oscar21]

If more people took my approach then we wouldn't have this nonsense to deal with in the first place. Building sites need electricians at the end of the day, good ones aren't that easy to come by so when youturn up and they say have you got this card and that card just reply "look, I don't want your life story, do you want the job doing or not mate". If everyone said that then the work place would be a lot more simple. The rubbish sparks would soon get weeded out.

 

[nicebutdim]

If more people took my approach then we wouldn't have this nonsense to deal with in the first place. Building sites need electricians at the end of the day, good ones aren't that easy to come by so when youturn up and they say have you got this card and that card just reply "look, I don't want your life story, do you want the job doing or not mate". If everyone said that then the work place would be a lot more simple. The rubbish sparks would soon get weeded out.

Similar applies to domestic guys cutting prices to nothing, but it'll never happen. Things have been great for a while, but as work dries up it'll be back to the same old. Best qualified among all trades, but not a lick of sense among them.

 

[1David]

I am experiencing a similar problem except I don't have the completion certificate from pre 1994.
I contacted the JIB who have no record of my apprenticeship - so I can't progress!!

Very frustrating - I can't register, can't get a Gold Card. can't join a scheme!!

Effectively I'm unemployable.

So I formally completed and finished my electrotechnical apprenticeship with JTL in 2003.
My apprenticeship was a standard five year and we only got entered into doing our AM2 once we had completed 5 years experience and shown neccessary experience in our log books. In this time I completed the various courses...
C&G Part 1 & 2 (236 I believe) AM1, AM2 and NVQ levels 2 & 3 (which were log book based)
Once I completed I got a nice certificate from JTL, and headed signed letters which also had JIB mark on it saying I've completed a formal apprenticeship in the electrotechnical industry and it listed all my quals. I also got a nice letter from JTL congratulating me and saying I've left funded training and my training contract was sent back to me.

Anyway I never applied for my card back then, my logic was I'll do my 2391 then get a "approved" card. So a few years later that's what I did, but unfortunately I never got around to applying for my card either and to be honest I never needed it.

Anyway now 15 years later, I want my card. My qualifications have been checked and verified, however I'm getting placed on hold because ECS think I'm still an Apprentice, they won't except my completion certificate, they won't except my my formal letters from JTL they won't except my original training contract from JTL because it says training deeds on the top .
The only thing they will except is a JIB409 form, the trouble is I no longer have contact with the company I completed my apprenticeship with back in 2003.

When I rang them up the woman said " I can see you have completed, but we can only accept an original training contract or a JIB409".

I work for myself now, I've tried sending copys off to JTL but I never get anything back. A few months this has been going on now.

Surely it can't be this hard, does everyone have this issue.