EICR- Are Rcd's necessary ?

[davesparks]

Fair point, so if it was a socket liable to supply outdoor equipment, would you give it a C2? How would you define that?

In typical IET fashion it was a bit more specific in the green book, but now they have made it less clear in this book! It used to state that bathrooms without supplementary bonding or RCDs are a C2 and that sockets externally or to be used externally are also C2 (if memory serves correctly)
All other sockets requiring RCD but not provided with it were C3.

 

[sparksburnout]

In typical IET fashion it was a bit more specific in the green book, but now they have made it less clear in this book! It used to state that bathrooms without supplementary bonding or RCDs are a C2 and that sockets externally or to be used externally are also C2 (if memory serves correctly)
All other sockets requiring RCD but not provided with it were C3.

Bit open to interpretation this "likely to be used externally"! Could be any socket downstairs near a window......

 

[Risteard]

No, you read the text of the above and do not give it a code of any description, the regulations are not retrospective.

Aside from the fact that any lack of RCD protection must at a minimum be given a C3 observation, it is not true that something which complied at the time of installation cannot have an observation. It must be if safety is a concern - the old Regulations are not relevant to the inspection being carried out to the current Edition.

 

[Deleted member 9648]

It is clearly a safety concern if a socket which might reasonably be expected to supply mobile equipment outdoors has no RCD provision. Regardless of current wording of the regulations that is a code 2.

 

[Flanders]

I think if you understand the dangers of using portable equipment outdoors you would give a code 2 observation for sockets liable to be used outdoor regardless of what tbe regs says and you can not rely on the fact that a rcd adapter would be used in a domestic environment

 

[HappyHippyDad]

I agree with wirepuller. Sockets used for supplying portable equipment outdoors should have RCD protection, if they do not then I would code it a C2 (and I consider myself fairly 'forgiving' on the coding side).

However, do we just use our judgement if we think a socket will be used for supplying portable equipment outdoors? Do we ask the homeowner? Do we have a sneaky look in the garage to see if there is an electric strimmer or lawnmower?

I don't think we can assume someone will always use an 'RCD plug in socket' everytime they plug in the lawnmower. So if we assume that most people will at some point use electricity outside that means they are going to use one of the sockets that does not have RCD protection. So I suppose, no RCD protection on any ground floor sockets should be a code C2 (yet I've only ever given it a C3)!!

I'll have to have a think about this now!

 

[rustynails]

I have been asked to carry out repair works in a house which has had a condition report completed by another electrician.

It would depend on the minor works being completed. I would say at best it would be recommended to install an rcd for safety and to comply the repair works with the bs7671 latest edition so that you are able to issue a minor or eic cert as an qualified registered electrician.

 

[Hamez]

Hi Guys,

Thanks for all your help!
The property is on the first and second floor and there is no sockets that could be used to supply i.e. a lawn mower.

I will just code it as a c3 and recommend it to be upgraded.

I have read the best practice guide but do any of you know of any books worth reading on EICR's?


Thanks

 

[Andy78]

Where will you be recording the C3 code ? I thought the EICR had already been carried out by another ?

 

[Hamez]

The property is to be letted and it needs to have an EICR that ensures that the property is safe.
So I will be completing a new form once I have corrected any other issues .

 

[Andy78]

The property is to be letted and it needs to have an EICR that ensures that the property is safe.
So I will be completing a new form once I have corrected any other issues .

You will be carrying out a full new EICR ?

 

[Hamez]

I will be yes, If its my name going on the report I need to know it is all good!

 

[Andy78]

What a state of affairs.
EICR carried out, remedial work needed, next electrician disagrees, new EICR done, customer charged twice, electricians as a whole devalued in the mind of the customer.

 

[Hamez]

The client needs to have an EICR to prove that the property is of a good enough standard so someone is going to have to fill one out. What would you do in this situation ?

 

[Andy78]

The client needs to have an EICR to prove that the property is of a good enough standard so someone is going to have to fill one out. What would you do in this situation ?

Issue a MWC or EIC as appropriate for any remedial work and tell the customer to contact the original inspector and see how he feels about your opinions and reissuing the EICR. I would provide reference to the regs and the best practice guide to support this.
If he is unwilling to change the EICR and the customer is happy to pay, then of course I would carry out another EICR.

I was just pointing out that looking from the customer's perspective, it all looks a right rigmarole.