English Heritage

[rebreather]

Hello Chaps
A few questions from a humble plumber !
Doing an install in a Grade 2 listed buillding & want to pick your brains. The house has been rewired & English Heritage have made the sparks refit the new sockets in the skirting, they not allowed them to drill through the wooden beams, so the cable is clipped to the surface with no protection, ie trunking & they've run the new cable through existing holes in the timbers but the cables are tight against the existing central heating pipes !Is all this correct, I thought Building Regs took precedence ?

 

[telectrix]

cables should not be in contact with pipes carrying hot water. T/E can be surface clipped if consideration is given as to it's location and susceptibility to mechanical damage. why have they not used MICC?

 

[rebreather]

cables should not be in contact with pipes carrying hot water. T/E can be surface clipped if consideration is given as to it's location and susceptibility to mechanical damage. why have they not used MICC?

You tell me, I'm only a plumber & not a highly qualified sparks ! I know cable next to hot pipes is wrong but what about the sockets ? Plus, some of the T&E is at skirting level.

 

[Richard Burns]

The height of the surface run cables is immaterial. (it may be inappropriate for the location but not forbidden).
If they are in trunking they have some level of protection against knock and scrapes.
There should at least be an insulating barrier between the hot pipes and the cables (even if it were just a length of trunking lid!! (not recommended)).

Running a cable in a hot environment will derate the cable current carrying capacity and lower the life expectancy of the cable, and if hot enough melt the sheath and insulation and cause a short circuit.

 

[Andy78]

Just to illustrate Richard Burns' point.....


This cable was laid over a central heating pipe.

 

[telectrix]

Just to illustrate Richard Burns' point.....
View attachment 30084

This cable was laid over a central heating pipe.

sure it wasn't you trying out a new set of teeth? :sad_smile:

 

[Andy78]

sure it wasn't you trying out a new set of teeth? :sad_smile:

Well I can't remember my packing up every day now can I ?

 

[rebreather]

The height of the surface run cables is immaterial. (it may be inappropriate for the location but not forbidden).
If they are in trunking they have some level of protection against knock and scrapes.
There should at least be an insulating barrier between the hot pipes and the cables (even if it were just a length of trunking lid!! (not recommended)).

Running a cable in a hot environment will derate the cable current carrying capacity and lower the life expectancy of the cable, and if hot enough melt the sheath and insulation and cause a short circuit.

The pipe temp will be around 80c so plenty of scope for degradation I would have thought. I was mainly interested in weather E/H could over ride building regs on the sockets or not. I'll asak NAPPIT on Monday

 

[rebreather]

Also, I've just seen where they've cable tied a T&E to a central heating pipe because there wasn't any fixed surface to clip it too !!!

 

[Richard Burns]

Certain listed building or building of national significance may be excluded from building regulations compliance where the change will alter the structure or words to that effect or so.
So in certain circumstances EH may override BC but I am not sure of the details, overall EH is only more of a nuisance than BC, but it does not sound like a very good installation.
The socket height can be anything so long as it is safe, but this dose not sound like it is avoiding straining the flexes when plugging in.

 

[HandySparks]

Just to illustrate Richard Burns' point.....
View attachment 30084

This cable was laid over a central heating pipe.

Was this squashed between pipe and floorboard or was this just the weight of the cable on the hot pipe?

 

[Andy78]

Was laid over the pipe. Was not trapped I don't recall, just years of overheating I suspected.