FIA fire alarm course.

[rattlehead85]

I would like to know if anybody has attended and completed the fire alarm course offered by FIA and if so how much did it set them back and what was the quality of teaching like they provided. I am looking to take on some alarm work soon but need to improve my knowledge of this type of install as it is very limited at present.

 

[i=p/u]

Think Sinatra recommended them one time.. Think . units 1, 4 , 5 was the basic ones to stat with

considered it myself but I ain't paying for it hopefully

 

[rattlehead85]

It looks expensive so i would like to know what the course content is like. Last thing i wanna do is fork out a rake of cash to find it is ya typical rush through make money amateur carry on.

 

[accordfire]

It looks expensive so i would like to know what the course content is like. Last thing i wanna do is fork out a rake of cash to find it is ya typical rush through make money amateur carry on.

The FIA courses are the old BFSPA ones, and yes, for a technician, most firms would look for you having passed units 1,4 and 5 - they are still considered the cornerstone of fire system knowledge.

Were I employing at the moment, I'd give preference to anyone holding them, as it shows a competence in design (Unit 1), Installation and testing (Unit 4) and maintenance (Unit 5).

Like most of these things, they are designed to impart a certain amount of training and knowledge, but primarily to assess competence.

What I WOULD say, and it's something I'm not sure of right now - is check that you'll be getting any update in respect of BS5839-1 as a revision is due out this year, by around April or May I think. Knowing the FIA they will have it covered, but do check.

Part 6 is also due for revision, as of now is still a 2004 Standard, but will be revised for 2014.

The good thing about it is you can do a 3 day course which covers all three modules - but if you don't have 3 days, make sure you get Unit 1 at least, and if you have electrical knowledge, a lot of firms will be happy at that level. Costs are about £450 for members and I think £675 or so for non members. Typical salary for a fully employed fire alarm technician seems to be around £26-£28k basic at present.

Unit 1 typically covers the Standards, legislation (e.g. RRO, HASAW, other fire law), Categories, detector choice, etc - all the basics of design.

Unit 4 covers install and testing (not commissioning) - and is a good guide to what to look out for and what to consider when installing - e.g. where to locate panels, what cable to use, what size a zone can be, and so on.

Unit 5 covers maintenance - basic testing, checking the system still complies, what to do about false alarms, and so on.

It covers (all three cover) a good basic knowledge in the field, and I guarantee you'll complete the course and look at fire alarm systems very differently than you do now.

 

[rattlehead85]

Sounds very good. Think i will go for the three day combined 1,4 &5 unit course and then fill in units 2,3 & 6 after.
Looks like 1.5k may just cover it.

 

[accordfire]

Sounds very good. Think i will go for the three day combined 1,4 &5 unit course and then fill in units 2,3 & 6 after.
Looks like 1.5k may just cover it.

Well, 2&3 of most use if you're going to sign off on design of systems, and 6 good if you're going to sign off on commissioning too.

If you're going to do all the modules, it might well be worth looking for membership and getting the reduced rates. Associate membership is around £200 at last list, and worth it, as you'll get the bulletins etc. as well, and a very knowledgeable helpline.

From Associate membership, you'll get access to help too if you want to go on and get the SP203 - third party certification scheme (which more and more are looking for) if you're doing your own work. Realistically, that's a couple of grand's worth at some point, and we're looking at doing that this year - but for all modules as we do design, install, and commissioning as well as maintenance. Ultimately, that will get you full membership to the FIA. And, theoretically, more work on bigger systems.

You'll also get access to related courses if you want them like FRA and extinguishers.

 

[rattlehead85]

Thanks for the advice. Great help.

 

[i=p/u]

Ok just had look at fire alarm panel in my building its showing earth fault in all zones,

Il guess bad contacts on heads, but in all zones?? Can I open this panel without triggering any sounder , il say yes as opened panel before elsewhere and no new naw of sounder, comment on this what you like

 

[accordfire]

Ok just had look at fire alarm panel in my building its showing earth fault in all zones,

Il guess bad contacts on heads, but in all zones?? Can I open this panel without triggering any sounder , il say yes as opened panel before elsewhere and no new naw of sounder, comment on this what you like

Hi mate

You can pretty well always open a panel without triggering anything - no concept (usually) of tamper on a fire system.

Earth faults.... lovely!

Okay, what type of panel is it?

Earth faults can be caused by a number of things, in a number of different ways - is it softskin or pyro on site?

 

[i=p/u]

Il guess soft skin = fp200, haven't got model right now as is covered with sticker from installer, but il get this important info. There is lots of sounders and I mean about 20 faulty lying beneath panel in cupboard with L L1 and R terminals, il get this panel model soon as back at house. I ain't going to touch it just interested in what's common faults and why this keeps beeping cause it what I'm interested into these days lol

 

[accordfire]

Il guess soft skin = fp200, haven't got model right now as is covered with sticker from installer, but il get this important info. There is lots of sounders and I mean about 20 faulty lying beneath panel in cupboard with L L1 and R terminals, il get this panel model soon as back at house. I ain't going to touch it just interested in what's common faults and why this keeps beeping cause it what I'm interested into these days lol

Well, it's conventional - that's for sure

Yes, soft skin is FP200 or NoBurn, etc.. any of the breed really as a generic term - all tend to get referred to as soft skin as opposed to pyro, which as most of us know, ain't soft

Earth faults can be caused by a number of reasons, but strictly usually because there's transient voltage on a monitored earth. With that number of earth faults, I'd be looking at the panel first. Depending on the panel, you'll need an end of line resistor or capacitor for each circuit. Effectively, you want to recommission the panel first.

So, with end of lines in all detector terminals and bell terminals, does the panel clear? If so, then you know you've got a bucket load of earth faults out in the field. Start with zone 1 - stick it back in the panel, connect the earth - if clear, great. If not......

The process is about dividing the circuit down until you find the faulty section - so take the Eol out of the panel and stick it in a device somewhere known on the zone - remembering to remove outgoing wiring from the device too and keep increasing until the fault reappears. Once it does, you know where the issue is - between the previous device and the one you've just added - worth re-terminating that last section of cable both ends as nicks in the sheathing can cause untold problems.

For detectors and bells/sounders, there's usually a terminal to park the earths - not so on newer stuff at all though. Often you'll find earths have been made off in a terminal box to which the detector/bell is fixed, or just floating even, in some connector block. Essentially, for most systems - most conventional systems - the earth should be continuous along the entire cable run, but terminated only at the panel.

For addressable systems, like any ring final, it's terminated at the panel for both sides of the loop. You'll also find in some types of addressable system that certain field devices like zone monitors have a need for the earth terminal to be terminated too, so as to monitor earths on outward circuits.

 

[i=p/u]

i could fix that,lol but aint my problem, but then again it is because is ment to be protecting my family ... could this earth fault stop it operating????

 

[accordfire]

i could fix that,lol but aint my problem, but then again it is because is ment to be protecting my family ... could this earth fault stop it operating????

In simple terms, even with faults on the system, it should remain capable of generating an alarm over the remainder of the system.

You may find some of the system is limited, however - depending on the fault, it may not be able to tell you if a head has been removed, or if further faults develop -

But. I have to say too that I always work on the basis that there is no such thing as "no fault found" - or no fault for no reason. We always advise customers that any yellow light should be investigated quickly, as there's no real way to tell if it's limiting the detection and or warning capability of the system.

My worry would be that it's a fault on the panel - which *could* in some circumstances render the rest of the system useless....

 

[i=p/u]

need testing kit(can a smoke) or hairdryer i believe to check at about 3am lol so the rest complain.... if does sound, will reset stop the bells, they are loud.. or silence

 

[accordfire]

need testing kit(can a smoke) or hairdryer i believe to check at about 3am lol so the rest complain.... if does sound, will reset stop the bells, they are loud.. or silence

That'll do it lol

Test for pea(i)ce of mind (yours for peace, hers for piece lol)