H&S legislation boffin question

[amckay]

Hi all, I've not posted for a while. Today my colleague called me to have a winge about our manager. Out of the depot we work at there are 4 electricians who work under non electrical team leaders and managers (we do maintenance on outdoor media) and we are the only ones with electrical knowledge which is highly annoying because we have to constantly justify to idiots why we have done what etc. Anyway the said colleague rang as he was the only spark in today and was asked to go to an "emergency" call from a welsh local authority to attend an replace a severely rusted/corroded enclosure on a bus shelter. Now these enclosures almost always have a cable head inside (unless there is a pillar nearby) and as such we have always said its a two man job to do as the head is live (buried and jointed underground to the supply cable network). Now he's had a massive argument with the manager about this as the mgr thinks its a one man job and generally hasn't got a clue.
I've tried searching online but cannot find anything specific regarding 2 men working on live conductors 1working and the other for safety in case anything happens etc. Can anyone here point me in the right direction? Couldn't find anything on HSE EAWR/EAWA or MoG.
We are g39/1 qualified so can work on dno equipment.
Cheers lads

 

[telectrix]

copied from a HSE publication.

Anyone undertaking work on or near energised electrical conductors will nearlyalways require some form of accompaniment by someone who can give assistancein an emergency. This implies a degree of competence such that the accompanyingperson can assist without danger to themselves or others. A requirement for asecond person is to implement and maintain safe working procedures such as bypreventing encroachment of non authorised personnel into the working area.

http://www.iosh.co.uk/~/media/Docum...he Food Drink Industry Mike Frain.pdf?la=en


round about page 38 of the above publication.

 

[snowhead]

The above quote seems perfect but you don't need legislation.

If your own personal risk assessment says you can only carry out the work with assistance, then that's that.
No one else can over ride your decision.
They could attempt to discipline you but they'd end up looking stupid.

.

 

[amckay]

Thanks tel.
Good point about the personal risk assessment. Cheers.

 

[Pete999]

Hi all, I've not posted for a while. Today my colleague called me to have a winge about our manager. Out of the depot we work at there are 4 electricians who work under non electrical team leaders and managers (we do maintenance on outdoor media) and we are the only ones with electrical knowledge which is highly annoying because we have to constantly justify to idiots why we have done what etc. Anyway the said colleague rang as he was the only spark in today and was asked to go to an "emergency" call from a welsh local authority to attend an replace a severely rusted/corroded enclosure on a bus shelter. Now these enclosures almost always have a cable head inside (unless there is a pillar nearby) and as such we have always said its a two man job to do as the head is live (buried and jointed underground to the supply cable network). Now he's had a massive argument with the manager about this as the mgr thinks its a one man job and generally hasn't got a clue.
I've tried searching online but cannot find anything specific regarding 2 men working on live conductors 1working and the other for safety in case anything happens etc. Can anyone here point me in the right direction? Couldn't find anything on HSE EAWR/EAWA or MoG.
We are g39/1 qualified so can work on dno equipment.
Cheers lads

Sounds like your manager is a jobsworth, take heed of the documents Tel has sent you, better still give your management a copy. Even better still ask him to work on his own and watch his behind do a sixpence, shilling job (start to panic in old school lingo)

 

[UNG]

What does your companies H&S policy say about working unaccompanied on live equipment or does the company not have a H&S policy

 

[Pete999]

What does your companies H&S policy say about working unaccompanied on live equipment or does the company not have a H&S policy

Good point,
OP does your firm company have a H&S Officer, by law you have to have a H&S Policy and remember you are responsible as an operative to report any H&S matters to your management, or is the firm you work for a tuppenny halfpenny outfit that shuns all the rules and regulations? (substitute tuppenny halfpenny for cowboy outfit if you are to young to understand).

 

[amckay]

Yeah Pete I understand lol. We do have H&S people but the new guy is pretty useless, he came to us from JJB the sports shop! I'd imagine the h&s policy to be pretty long winded as the firm operates in 30 countries worldwide and I work out of their largest depot in the uk. I found what I was looking for in the memorandum of guidance after double checking.
I'll put it to him Monday and if he sees his posterior about it, I'll point blank refuse to continue any electrical work until I see their h&s policy, method statement and risk assessments. That'll put the cat amongst the pigeons and make me extremely popular with senior management for the next 6 months at least...

 

[Pete999]

Yeah Pete I understand lol. We do have H&S people but the new guy is pretty useless, he came to us from JJB the sports shop! I'd imagine the h&s policy to be pretty long winded as the firm operates in 30 countries worldwide and I work out of their largest depot in the uk. I found what I was looking for in the memorandum of guidance after double checking.
I'll put it to him Monday and if he sees his posterior about it, I'll point blank refuse to continue any electrical work until I see their h&s policy, method statement and risk assessments. That'll put the cat amongst the pigeons and make me extremely popular with senior management for the next 6 months at least...

rI know what you mean mate I was the Prospect Union H&S Rep and we had a useless H&S manager for about 6 years, I think it may have been my continual harping on that finally they got a Professional in to kick things off, we worked well together until She left, so I suppose I got really into it until I retired, just remember if you get hauled over the coals for being a trouble maker , that it's bosses neck on the line should anyone get hurt, I have bad memories of doing something daft, the HSE got involved and that was scary.

 

[amckay]

I'm starting to think I should fake a shock just to get things noticed and acted upon. I think its because electricity is taken for granted by "ordinary persons" and the dangers of it are far too easy forgotten.

 

[Pete999]

Take him with you on a job and explain the dangers, as a H&S official he/she should already be aware of

 

[cranedude]

This is very interesting...im a local health and safety rep..our policy states we should work dead wherever possible...of course this isnt always practical....and impossible during certain testing.

when working live or near live we should have a competent colleague with us who is trained in rescusitation techniques ( doesnt necessarilly need to electrically qualified.....and if not should be briefed on what is expected of them in an emergency )

 

[telectrix]

these managers need bring down to earth. they don't have a clue about the dangers.

 

[Deleted member 26818]

Bond them?

 

[Barry White]

If you have safety concerns next time report as a "near miss" the company have to report this to hse and put a procedure in place to prevent it happening.