Hours spent pricing and doing customer site meeting....

[Leesparkykent]

Just a bit of a rant really....This one job that is pretty much mine as do all the builders work and the customer has confirmed that I'm doing the job.

6/7 bed house just around the corner from my house. 1st site meeting I Sit down with the customer for 2 hours and went through what ideas they have etc. I then spend about 8 hours pricing and doing a rough sketch over the drawings for positions.

Submit drawings and quote and customer comes back and says above budget.

Second site meeting I sit down with customers again for 2 hours and look at where we can make some savings...Doesn't go great as customer doesn't want to compromise as still wants the lot. Sharpen the pencil slightly and save them a few quid by scaling it down, choosing different fittings etc and re price which takes another 4 hours.

3rd site meeting tonight (another 2 hours) which I thought would be just striking the deal but customer wants to go over it again. He wants costs for different variables because he has a budget which he needs to stick with but builder has had a few unexpected issues which has ended up costing a few quid.

Money isn't an issue with the customer as he has pots of it but wants to strike the balance between build cost and what it will be worth once complete.

So now I have to wait for builder to nail down his final cost so then I can resubmit with whatever is left in the pot. So far I've spent 18 hours on the job and still haven't got the customer to sign on the dotted line.

It's really annoying as he's a nice chap and I do get that the cost has to be proportional to the end result but come on mate I'm nearly 20 hours in .....

 

[The Ghost]

Well courting the customer is part of landing the job. However I get the frustration at time spent with nothing on the hook. I tend to work out a price and leave it with the customer. If they think it is too much I say well that is the only price I have for the job, try to get some other estimates. Because I know the price I will put in is fair (which is unusual) I know they will come back after falling off the chair at other prices, or not if they use the amazing prices you can get out there for cash and no cert.
But there we are we all have our different methods eh! I just would not have your patience or time for all that fanangling.

 

[Dave OCD]

I think my patience may have ran out by now Lee and I'd suddenly be far too busy to undertake this job.

 

[jackhammerJIM]

Awkward customer. Im dealing with one on a job at the moment . Keeps changing his mind and adding points then questions the extras

 

[Leesparkykent]

The thing is the job is going to be a real show piece....RAKO lighting and blinds, sonos throughout, gated access, cctv, intruder, heated garage for classic cars that has a rotating car changer, tesla wall, swimming pool, tennis courts, stables, par 3 golf hole, lake, gym etc. You can see why I want the job as it will be brilliant for the portfolio.

 

[Leesparkykent]

Awkward customer. Im dealing with one on a job at the moment . Keeps changing his mind and adding points then questions the extras

price the extras and get him to confirm them via email before you do them.

 

[Dave OCD]

This guy has to be a multi millionaire Lee, makes it all the more frustrating when they quibble over an honest quote. They want a Rolls Royce job at Ford prices.

 

[jackhammerJIM]

The thing is the job is going to be a real show piece....RAKO lighting and blinds, sonos throughout, gated access, cctv, intruder, heated garage for classic cars that has a rotating car changer, tesla wall, swimming pool, tennis courts, stables, par 3 golf hole, lake, gym etc. You can see why I want the job as it will be brilliant for the portfolio.

Sounds like a belter . Dont get much of that up my end .

 

[Dave OCD]

That's a relief, could be very painful.

 

[Leesparkykent]

Yeah he's worth a few quid. The company he owns design and make soft toys. The sort that cost about £30 for a teddy bear in gift shops when you take the kids out for the day The house itself isn't huge in relation to the land but it's everything else that goes with it. It will be a cracker of a job just got to nail the customer down.

 

[jackhammerJIM]

some jobs are worth doing for less if you know you will enjoy doing them in my opinion

 

[Leesparkykent]

some jobs are worth doing for less if you know you will enjoy doing them in my opinion

I won't be doing it for less that's for sure. Just need to strike the right balance between budget and expectations

 

[Octopus]

The aspect of being SE or the boss of a small business that people don't understand.

My last big job, all agreed, but still spent a lot of time discussing things before I did anything ..... Worth it inn the end

 

[jackhammerJIM]

I won't be doing it for less that's for sure. Just need to strike the right balance between budget and expectations

I can see some LAP gear getting used

 

[jackhammerJIM]

The aspect of being SE or the boss of a small business that people don't understand.

It sill amazes me that people who i refer to as having office jobs can literally not even know what a red plug is used for . Trying to explain to people why we have to do things certain ways i don't know whether to laugh or cry .

 

[Leesparkykent]

I can see some LAP gear getting used

yeah mate....I was thinking lap screwless flat plate and a bespoke Proteus panel for the distribution

 

[The Ghost]

Yeh I can see why you are going the extra mile for that one. So strike what I said earlier, I would have the patience. Just had a lovely job for LARA art school in Bristol. Lutron controls x 10 with 36 high CRI Cree panels and spots to make it perfect for colour rendering. Using the law of inverse squares calculating lumens and the fall off on easels etc., pretty tech. but fascinating. Really interesting job didn't charge full on as I wanted this in my portfolio.

 

[PEG]

Yeah he's worth a few quid. The company he owns design and make soft toys. The sort that cost about £30 for a teddy bear in gift shops when you take the kids out for the day The house itself isn't huge in relation to the land but it's everything else that goes with it. It will be a cracker of a job just got to nail the customer down.

You better hope he does not read the above...he'll smell your enthusiasm and book another meeting

How about getting him to give up something that won't hurt him as much as cash?...like 100 plush toy Leesparkyteds,each with their own little tool belt and volt pen...you could hand them out to executive customers...you'll make them meercats redundant

 

[PEG]

Yeah he's worth a few quid. The company he owns design and make soft toys. The sort that cost about £30 for a teddy bear in gift shops when you take the kids out for the day The house itself isn't huge in relation to the land but it's everything else that goes with it. It will be a cracker of a job just got to nail the customer down.

You better hope he does not read the above...he'll smell your enthusiasm and book another meeting

How about getting him to give up something that won't hurt him as much as cash?...like 100 plush toy Leesparkyteds,each with their own little tool belt and volt pen...you could hand them out to executive customers...you'll make them meercats redundant

 

[Leesparkykent]

You better hope he does not read the above...he'll smell your enthusiasm and book another meeting

How about getting him to give up something that won't hurt him as much as cash?...like 100 plush toy Leesparkyteds,each with their own little tool belt and volt pen...you could hand them out to executive customers...you'll make them meercats redundant

haha great idea

 

[NDG Elecs]

Yeah he's worth a few quid. The company he owns design and make soft toys. The sort that cost about £30 for a teddy bear in gift shops when you take the kids out for the day The house itself isn't huge in relation to the land but it's everything else that goes with it. It will be a cracker of a job just got to nail the customer down.

Could you PM me the brand of the bear please Lee, so I know who to boycott (even if my five years old daughter is screaming for it!).

You say he is a nice fella, but the picture painted tells me otherwise. I had a loaded customer recently, he was much more pleasant. There has to be an appreciation of the time you have spent so far on this, also there has to be some acceptance of your quoting. The constant knocking back would put me off doing the job as I would expect constant niggly nitpicking as the job progressed. Then it's back to square one; I can do it that way if you want but it will cost more......
Hope you get it but don't envy your position. Look forward to the pics though!!

 

[HappyHippyDad]

Crikey Lee, I think you've just got to bear with this one which I know you will be. Just let off your steam and get back to it

You say the chap seems ok so I guess he's just being extra cautious as it's such a big job with so many fancy extras that he wants just right.

A pain at the moment, but 'wow' when it's finished and you look at what you've done (and been paid of course!)

 

[davesparks]

Build the cost of site meetings and quoting into your final price.

 

[ED17]

This guy has to be a multi millionaire Lee, makes it all the more frustrating when they quibble over an honest quote. They want a Rolls Royce job at Ford prices.

Some of my customers want a Rolls Royce job at second hand Lada prices!

 

[Wilko]

A few thoughts ...
At some point you will have priced it enough times to really not want do it again. Are you there yet?
Who is your competition? You don't have to be perfect, just a bit better in the Customer's opinion.
Can you turn Customer away from price and towards value? LSK work is top class and has LSK Warranty. Not too many folks can actually put all he wants together and have it all work seamlessly.

 

[Squid]

He should have got the Architect to spec the job the positions of the fittings and which fittings to be used, would have made your job a lot easier.

Something like this,

 

[saint]

It sounds like you have designed the installation based on what he has asked for after going through various options to reduce the cost. So if you are happy with the price you have submitted, then its not you that needs to adjust anything, its just is expectations that need adjusting. might be a good job but if you don't do this job some thing else will just fill its place. I'd just let him sleep on it.

 

[UNG]

He wants costs for different variables because he has a budget which he needs to stick with but builder has had a few unexpected issues which has ended up costing a few quid.

Money isn't an issue with the customer as he has pots of it but wants to strike the balance between build cost and what it will be worth once complete.

It's really annoying as he's a nice chap and I do get that the cost has to be proportional to the end result but come on mate I'm nearly 20 hours in .....

This guy sounds like someone to avoid, over the years I've done a lot of high end property fit outs with mixed results

With some the cost to final value is not a consideration they just want it done a certain way and compromise is not an option they will live there and they want the best

With others they want it done that certain way and they want it on the cheap they want the best but don't want to pay for it and you generally get messed around

These sort of job's are the ones I call the triplicate book jobs, every variation, addition or wouldn't it be nice if is written down and they sign for it, it is then priced and agreed no if's or but's everything is clear some customers feel you don't trust them but it works both ways for me as some just try it on at every opportunity and you can end up losing a lot of money just adding an additional socket with some of the high end stuff

 

[hasel5]

Feel for you on this He saving on having someone design it and then wants to chip you Thats wrong in my eyes those hours you have wasted should be chargeable at a agreed rate as what a architect would charge

 

[Midwest]

Where's sparksburntout when you need him

 

[UNG]

He should have got the Architect to spec the job the positions of the fittings and which fittings to be used, would have made your job a lot easier.

Something like this,

View attachment 37766

IMO even with architect on board it can be problematic, the only advantage can be where the customer alters things and it is all done using architects instructions as it keeps the paper trail running through one person

 

[baldelectrician]

I always quote a 'per point' basis.

I had 1 extension / alteration which was costed at £1400 initially but she gave me the 'while you are here can you do this, that and the other'

She almost flipped when I told her the final cost and asked me how I came to that.
I asked her if she rememberd agreeing to the fixed cost per item and she said YES

I gave a breakdown via spread sheet with an itemised detail for every thing and she came over ' oh I see what you mean' and paid it.