Is it ok to tell a customer where to go?

[captaincaveman]

I've seldom wanted to tell a customer where to go but just got back from doing a quote in Bredbury, Stockport where I very nearly did!
The customer was after 3 quotes for a rewire after his consumer unit "blew up" and was replaced by an "NIC" electrician who told him he needed a new rewire and rodents may have chewed through cables.

However the customer didn't want me to look at anything - even how to access under the floor which was laminate, or the new consumer unit. I had a look at the ccu none the less and found it had been replaced with a clapped out plastic one with both cover latches broken and different manufacturers components being used. No certificate had been given (and guessing no testing done or building control notification). The cabling, which was a mix of black/red & brown/blue and all looked ok/no thermal damage evident.

I told him the replacement was substandard and he may not even need a rewire but rather an EICR would be more appropriate. The chances are the main switch had burnt out due to bad connections and wanted replacing. Afterall if there was a cable fault then the fault would still be there and tripping the protective device as whoever replaced the unit evidentially didn't look for a fault in the rest of the installation.

Alas, the customer wasn't at all interested in the fact he had a substandard illegitimate board replacement and that he could save thousands just by having a survey done. In fact he was more angry that I had taken the cover off the CCU and was having difficulty getting it to stay on again!
As he just wanted a figure for the rewire without me looking round, and not interested that he may not even need one, I came to the conclusion he had already decided on this "reputable" installer was going to do his rewire and he was just going through the motions of being 'sensible' by getting 3 quotes. So I just drew a number out of the sky and walked out of there with no intention of returning having wasted an hour and petrol.

If the installer of this replacement CCU reads this I'd be interested to know your explanation for installing a broken, plastic, mismatched ccu without paperwork/testing and telling the customer he needed a rewire (when I suspect he doesn't)??

Also, Can someone set up a database of customers to avoid pleeeeeease!

 

[HappyHippyDad]

If they are asking nicely, then I see no reason not to give them directions.

 

[captaincaveman]

"SAP" in my case. (Serious Attitude Problem)

SAP and DNA are good. I normally write a couple of words to describe why not to answer in the name box. From now on though I think I might use "DNO" - Do Not Oblige (or maybe - Definitely Not Ok) lol

 

[ControlsEngineer]

As an aside, I worked part time at a Home Depot in the electrical dept a few years ago to save for a down payment on a house. It was near Christmas and all these homeowners were coming in for cords, adaptors and such for outside lighting.
Being an electrician for almost 30 years I could answer questions but policy stated I was not supposed to offer construction/assembly/code advice as the store would be liable.
So a guy comes in and wants a 120V double male adaptor. I tell him there's no such thing, and it would be extremely dangerous. I asked him why he needed one and he said he stapled up his outside lights with the ends swapped. I suggested he switch the lights around for a proper install. That's when things started going south. He picked up some parts and asked if he could make an adaptor with the parts. I said more than likely, however there's a lot of liability for you if someone gets hurt or killed with said adaptor. He said that's not a problem I have insurance.
I said I see now why there's a setback from the property lines for single family homes. He said what's that got to do with anything? I told him to save his neighbor's house from burning down when his catches fire. He asked for the manager. The manager gave him 10% off and said maybe I wasn't cut out for retail. Ya think?

 

[timhoward]

So a guy comes in and wants a 120V double male adaptor. I tell him there's no such thing, and it would be extremely dangerous.

The last caravan I purchased (2nd hand) came with a 16A female socket inlet on it. So if the previous owner connected the supply end first they would been walking around with live pins in their hand.
I couldn't quite believe anyone would know enough to replace a socket but stupid enough to do that. Of course the first thing I did was swap it.

 

[pc1966]

I couldn't quite believe anyone would know enough to replace a socket but stupid enough to do that.

Alas, there is no lower limit on stupid!

 

[timhoward]

I forgot the pertinent bit! I always wondered if they used a standard lead and a DIY double-male adapter or made their own lead....

Alas, there is no lower limit on stupid!

Yes one company I do work for has an overly creative maintenance guy who is overly confident in their electrical abilities.
There is now a standard saying that the facilities manager and I regularly say to each other - "Never forget - nothing is fool proof for a sufficiently talented fool".

 

[Lister1987]

I find ---- works; Tight Wad Arrogant ---- ?

 

[brianmoooore]

So a guy comes in and wants a 120V double male adaptor. I tell him there's no such thing, and it would be extremely dangerous.

There was a major loss of power around my area for about two weeks, a few years ago, when freezing rain built up on the 11kV distribution lines and brought several miles of them down.
I came across loads of people using double male extension leads to plug small generators into the nearest convenient 13A socket.

 

[Simon47]

In a previous job, we got a call from one of our customers one day asking if it would work to plug a lead from a generator into a socket - because they'd got a notice about a planned outage. In the past I'd been up there with my small portable genny and run an extension lead up to the server room to keep the key equipment running, but this time they'd been given another option ...
I carefully explained that such a cable is called a widowmaker for a very good reason, and in any case they had a 3 phase supply and the socket would only power 1 phase. I think I had them with "widow maker" and "very dangerous" so the next bit was an easy sell - get your electrician to fit a power inlet and a changeover switch, which they arranged at very short notice.

Anyhow, I can't say too much as it would instantly identify the businesses concerned, our client's neighbour has a rather handy trailed diesel genny (around 80kVA IIRC) that they used to power some machinery if there wasn't a suitable site supply available. And the neighbour had offered to let them have some juice from it while they would be running their own office. And it turned out that said neighbour was in the habit of using this genny with a widowmaker lead (2off 32A 5 pin red BS4343 plugs) for their own premises.

On the day of the outage we got a call - the power inlet idea hadn't worked. So I set off, picking up my genny from home on the way. By the time I got there they'd sorted it - a combination of the inlet not having been wired correctly (no, no idea of details, this was just second hand via a non-technical person) and I noticed a somewhat bodged together cable in use (safe, but two cables into the BS4343 plug and socket).
I ended up chatting with one of the guys from next door. It turns out that their equipment only needs a 3 wire supply (no neutral), so all their cables only have 4 cores (3P+E) even though they had 5 pin plugs & sockets. So that explained why they'd had to bodge two cables into the plug & socket to get our client working - lucky not to blow any kit up I guess. I think I probably made some comment that this was dangerous, but his attitude was that only they'd use the cables for their own equipment so there was no problem. At the time they were still using a widowmaker in their own premises - and I definitely made a thing about the dangers in that (I think I saw them with an inlet fitted some time later)
I was really tempted to raise a RIDDOR about both the windowmaker and the 4 core cables - but at the time it would have caused big problems for us and our client, and I already had something of a reputation for putting noses out of joint.

 

[brianmoooore]

At least the BS4343 has a shroud around the live pins, although they're still readily touchable at the end, of course. The leads I wrote about had ordinary domestic 13A plugs on each end........
Four core cables with 5 pin plugs sounds a very good way to blow up something at some point.

 

[Andrew Hunter]

Also, Can someone set up a database of customers to avoid pleeeeeease!

Lol do you not know? “All costumers ar B——-d’s”

 

[Vortigern]

To answer your question, No! It is part of being a professional that we remain polite and ready to listen even if the dialogue is put to us in an unacceptable way. I feel that being polite is always the best course and is good for business. Having said that, it does not preclude saying firmly and politely that you would not be happy doing this job as it would not be a good outcome or words to that effect. But, no never be rude, there are all sorts of repercussions in doing so and it is best not to go there imho.

 

[baldelectrician]

To answer your question, No! It is part of being a professional that we remain polite and ready to listen even if the dialogue is put to us in an unacceptable way. I feel that being polite is always the best course and is good for business. Having said that, it does not preclude saying firmly and politely that you would not be happy doing this job as it would not be a good outcome or words to that effect. But, no never be rude, there are all sorts of repercussions in doing so and it is best not to go there imho.

I am the same, although I do comment on things I find on a quote to cover my back

Other times I just walk away and 'forget' to quote if I get a feeling

 

[Timbo]

There is now a standard saying that the facilities manager and I regularly say to each other - "Never forget - nothing is fool proof for a sufficiently talented fool".

We have a saying "Make something idiot-proof and they'll make a better class of idiot!"