Legal requirements for electrical work in retail stores

[Corlawson]

Hi
Can someone please give me some guidance on the following situation I find myself in. I'm employment as a Mobile Fabric Engineer (qualified Joiner) on repairs to retail buildings. I am constantly been told by my line manager to attend and complete electrical works such as fitting new wall heaters as replacements, repairing emergency and 240w lighting by fitting replacement ballasts, replacing light fittings with new and the replacement of broken sockets and switch's. I have requested to undertake my 17th edition and minor works testing course which the company have refused to do for over 2 years. First of all am I breaking the law by carrying this work out and will I be liable if a fault is found on the circuit after I have installed a new appliance because I have failed to produce a minor works certificate. Any advice would be greatly appreciated.

Cheers
Cor

 

[GMES]

Hi Cor and welcome to the forum.

 

[Richard Burns]

The work you describe is generally considered as maintenance operations and does not specifically require a minor works certificate, though one can be provided.
In terms of the replacement of fittings you must be competent in what you do and be able to demonstrate that competence if required to do so. Training courses are a good way of doing this.

For a maintenance operation the replacement item must operate in the same way as the original, e.g. a heater should be the same wattage, any change from this would require the circuit to be assessed for suitability and, if required, modifications made and a minor works certificate provided.
In terms of building regulations you would only be required to ensure that the compliance with the building regulations was not worse than when you started, but you would already be applying that to your general work.

I think the key point would be competence and understanding of what you are doing. If you can be shown to understand the limitations imposed on this work and be able to ensure that you are installing and connecting items safely and are able to identify where such a replacement may not be safe then you should be OK.

You would be liable for faults originating from the incorrect or dangerous connection or installation of the item in question, not for the circuit attached, so long as it was a matching replacement.

 

[Deleted member 26818]

From a legal standpoint, you must have such experience, technical knowledge or be under adequate supervision so as to be aware of the dangers electricity may present to yourself and others. (The actual wording can be found in Regulation 16 of the EAWR 1989.)
If you feel that you do not have sufficient experience or technical knowledge to conduct the work unsupervised, then your employers are legally required to provide you with relevant training or supervision.

Another point would be in regards to your and your employers' insurance.
Are you covered to conduct the work without relevant qualifications?

 

[Octopus]

Do you do any tests on the bits you fix?

 

[Corlawson]

Hi everyone thanks for the replies all I am being told St present is that there is no funds for training and to pay for the training myself. The only thing the company have supplied is a locking off kit for safe isolation and a meter to test for live circuits. I was called to a job where a 13 amp fused spur was over heating which operating a 3kw heater. I fitted a new heater and replaced the 13 amp fused spur with a 20 amp double pole switch. 2 months later the,, 20 amp fused spur over heated again. Now I can't test the circuit because I can't produce a minor works certificate, which was a major concern. I've got no electrical qualifications at all.

 

[Adam W]

I don't see how they can hold you liable if anything goes wrong if they've told you to do work which you haven't been trained to do; not only that but you've asked for the training which they haven't given you.
Telling a chippy to do electrical work is asking for trouble IMO - it's like asking a dental nurse to perform brain surgery.

 

[snowhead]

To the O.P,
Draft a letter along the lines of what you have said, i.e you are continually being asked to do electrical work and have asked for training which has not yet been arranged.

Get your Line Manager to sign to say he agrees and keep it as your defense (along with you feared the loss of your job so carried on) when HSE come after both you and more so your employer.

In the event of an incident, Your employer will have no hesitation in blaming you for not telling him you weren't competent.

However it's your employers responsibility to ensure all their employees have suitable qualifications for the job they are asked to do.
They are most likely in breach of their contract(s) with the retailers as that will stipulate employment of suitably qualified staff.

The heater situation needs investigating by someone who is qualified before the building burns down.

 

[HappyHippyDad]

Hi everyone thanks for the replies all I am being told St present is that there is no funds for training and to pay for the training myself. The only thing the company have supplied is a locking off kit for safe isolation and a meter to test for live circuits. I was called to a job where a 13 amp fused spur was over heating which operating a 3kw heater. I fitted a new heater and replaced the 13 amp fused spur with a 20 amp double pole switch. 2 months later the,, 20 amp fused spur over heated again. Now I can't test the circuit because I can't produce a minor works certificate, which was a major concern. I've got no electrical qualifications at all.

As the others have said you need to be 'competent'. This could be determined by a good understanding of the wiring regulations and perhaps relevant qualifications. If it was simply replacing lights etc as a 'like for like' replacement then perhaps you could undertake this, however in your above post you have removed a 13A fused spur which was protecting the cable and replaced it with a 20A double pole switch which will not offer any protection. The '20A' just means that the switch is 'rated' up to 20A, i.e the switch itself can take up to 20A of current safely, it does not have a fuse in it which will protect the cable.

I think you should definitely be insisting on relevant training or supervision as SL has said.

 

[Skelly]

I know this is late but to be honest you need to stick to your guns and refuse to do any electrical work until they send your for 17th Edition.
Just quote them the new regs, Part 2 " Definitions"

 

[Swcfisher]

I know this is late but to be honest you need to stick to your guns and refuse to do any electrical work until they send your for 17th Edition.
Just quote them the new regs, Part 2 " Definitions"View attachment 32428

he needs more than being able to read a regs book!

 

[Skelly]

Yes I know that, It's so his bloody manager will send him on the correct training courses. He should refuse to do the work, They can't fire him or I should say shouldn't, Then he could take to a tribunal if they did and he would win.
Some FM companies just don't care but there are some that do also.