You are looking at about £500+VAT for the assembly and a full day maybe £300+VAT to install so a maximum of £1000inc unless there were other works going on or specific problems on the install.
Are you asking how much for the board alone, or the board with Install?
Ignore this just seen last post.
Ignore this just seen last post.
Wish I was earning that on a board change
I would've come in at about £550 If there was no bonding to do etc based on a days work.
I would've come in at about £550 If there was no bonding to do etc based on a days work.
Wish I was earning that on a board change
I'm finding that an upgrade to bonding is needed 9 times out of 10, and I rarely find an installation which hasn't got issues that need sorting. I reckon an average board change these days for me is anything between £800 and £1200
Do you agree that price before hand? I do think board changes will eventually go up as there can be a lot of unpredicted rubbish.
In fairness if the pricing was agreed or never asked for then there isn't anything wrong with it. I certainly wouldn't criticise someone for charging good money for work. Unfortunately in many places it is hard to sustain fair (to the Electrician) charges.
L
Leesparkykent
Risteard is this your signature or has the forum dropped an advert in that looks like your endorsing?
Edit: No its the forum ...It now looks like I'm pluging screwfix as I'm the last poster lol
I try to do some basic tests before quoting, but that in itself can cause problems...
Firstly, do we charge to test the installation, knowing that we may not get the work? If so, how long do we work for free?
Secondly, assuming that the IR tests are ok, what if there is a break in the ring on one or more circuits? I find this on nearly every board change).
Thirdly, when changing from an old rewireable to an RCD board, do we test all appliances which could have earth leakage?
Fourthly, do we check that there are no shared neutrals across lighting circuits?
Obviously, once we start testing circuits properly, we may find missing earths, dodgy connections, spurs off spurs, incorrectly-sized cables, missing enclosures, damaged accessories, and so on.
Well that is why you should test it first.
L
Leesparkykent
What you could do is say to the customer that when changing a CU the circuits your reconnecting has to be safe to do so. If you find something that's not safe there may be an additional cost to make it safe which will be discussed if a problem arises or the circuit cant be connected. To circumnavigate this you could have an EICR done for a small fee of £££ which will bring up any defects and if any are found this can be discussed and priced before you proceed with the change. If you have the CU change done within 2-3 days of the EICR I can offer you a discount of ££ amount as I have all the results of the dead tests from the EICR. This way you earn extra from doing the report having a chance to price defects without being under pressure and if the customer isn't willing to pay an additional cost to rectify any defects your still quids in from doing the report.
David M
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In an ideal world this would work great.
Reality is (in my experience) the majority of folk don't want to pay to be told that their "perfectly working electrics" are faulty and need repairs/upgrades. We are stuck between a rock and a hard place in my opinion.
L
Leesparkykent
Agreed but then your half way through a CU change and problems start coming to light...Who's the bad guy then when you say I cant connect this particular circuit as its not safe..if you do want the fault rectified and the circuit connected its going to cost you £££ extra. A customer could potentially feel held to ransom IMO. If the customer isn't willing to pay to have it put right then I wouldn't want them as a customer in the 1st place and if you've discussed the option of an EICR first and the customer doesn't opt for it then I could sleep easily knowing I didn't connect the problem circuit/s and wouldn't feel bad for it.
So, out of interest, what exactly would you class as an existing problem that would render the circuit "unsafe to reconnect", bearing in mind you will very often be making the installation safer by doing the change? Surely the fact that borrowed neutrals or spurs off spurs may exist are not reason enough not to reconnect the circuit?
My point is, how much testing do you do for free? A day? A couple of hours?
O
Octopus
On EVERY estimate I send, which includes a CU change or upgrade, the following is stated:
"NB: If problems are detected during the fuseboard change additional work may be required. Such issues and associated costs will be discussed with you, prior to being implemented"
Never had a complaint, never had it questioned, rarely have to increase costs.....
"NB: If problems are detected during the fuseboard change additional work may be required. Such issues and associated costs will be discussed with you, prior to being implemented"
Never had a complaint, never had it questioned, rarely have to increase costs.....
Completely agree, rock and a hard place. I say the same thing as Murdoch, but even then I feel like I'm just the bearer of bad news all the time.
The most often found problem IMO is borrowed neutrals. Round here it is almost not worth checking first because all the houses on certain estates were wired in the same way. As has been stated, if you mention to the client that they will need there newly decorated hall/landing pulling to bits or any other disruption they will just say that they have "never had a problem in the last 25 years" so why do you need to do it now, and then another spark will come along and just do the job anyway. Personally I really can't see why it is a massive problem to put all the lights on one (RCD protected) breaker, obviously it won't "comply" but hardly the end of the world? Most people have table lamps and torches.
Me, as long as it takes, domestics don't take long. I find the problems, if there are any first. Each to their own.
So if you found a borrowed neutral, would you tell the customer it's no-can-do unless it's resolved, come what may?
No quote for replacing CU would include necessary remedial.
L
Leesparkykent
you could put them on the same MCB. Obviously not ideal due to division of circuits to minimise disruption but better than having a borrowed neutral IMO. It would be best to discuss both options with the customer. Having both on the same MCB makes them 1 circuit by definition so no borrowed neutral.
So you test and inspect free of charge for as long as it takes, before you've even got the job. I admire that.
As for domestics not taking long...
I don't think most customers would give a monkeys about having all their lights on one MCB, rather than shelling out for additional work and possible re-decoration.
S
stevethesparks
Whilst I don't disagree with preliminary testing, its always likely that any such problems highlighted to the customer may give rise to suspicion and divert the work to another electrician who doesn't give a ----.
The one easy preliminary and sensible test to undertake is an earth leakage test of which takes no time and doesn't cause any disruption. Down-powering is not always convenient to the customer, particularly when they have just got in from work and have got the evening meal cooking.
Not only that but there are also a lot of time wasters out there that your testing time can be wasted on, or the information given, passed on for the next cheaper quotation
I like the idea of offering an EICR with discount if work proceeds, but as Murdoch does, I supply a similar clause in my quotations with the effect that minor remedial corrections will be attended as a matter of course within the same price, and major or more difficult to resolve defects will be highlighted on my report. Broken rings (if not easy to find) are normally easily overcome by reducing the ocd as a temporary solution.
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No client wants CU changed and we always charge for test first. If some want to spend the night looking for faults cos rcds keep tripping, that is their decision. How many threads do we see on here that someone finds a fault AFTER alterations and then tries to find a way around it. As I say each to their own.
Ah, that's fair enough. I didn't realise that you actually charge for the testing, which makes more sense.
Yes, I feel the same!
I also write almost the same in my quote regarding any complications that may arise, but still feel embarrassed or even guilty when I say I am going to have to do extra work and it will cost more than the quote. I can't really see any way around this, you have to do the work to make it safe therefore I guess the answer is to change the way you/I feel about it.
David M
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When I quote on a CU upgrade I find its pointless explaining to the customer about borrowed neutrals, earth leakage and such like. I just give them in layman terms something along the line of -
The new modern CU's have devices that are sensitive to minor faults that the old fuse board could not detect. These devices are there to help protect against electric shock in the event of a fault that may cause harm. If any faults are found in your existing installation they may require repairing or upgrading so the new CU can function as intended and/or the safety of the installation meets requirements of the current regs.
I don't like to scare monger, but folk don't see the point of having the necessary work done if they don't understand why it is required. Safety is by far the most important aspect of any electrical installation, as we all well know.
For me being honest and advising on what I feel is a safety issue is far more important than quoting current reg requirements to the customer who will not have a clue what you are talking about and most likely think you are spinning a yarn to justify the cost.
The new modern CU's have devices that are sensitive to minor faults that the old fuse board could not detect. These devices are there to help protect against electric shock in the event of a fault that may cause harm. If any faults are found in your existing installation they may require repairing or upgrading so the new CU can function as intended and/or the safety of the installation meets requirements of the current regs.
I don't like to scare monger, but folk don't see the point of having the necessary work done if they don't understand why it is required. Safety is by far the most important aspect of any electrical installation, as we all well know.
For me being honest and advising on what I feel is a safety issue is far more important than quoting current reg requirements to the customer who will not have a clue what you are talking about and most likely think you are spinning a yarn to justify the cost.
You can quote all the reg's and theories you like, but at the end of the day, when it comes down to actually operating in the real world, you have to be practical. Around my way there is an estate of around 2000 houses, and about 5 local sparks all competing for the work. These is almost an "accepted price" for a CU change, all the houses are virtually the same, all had 3036 boards complete with a borrowed neutral for the landing light. You don't need to test it first, it just has. I can guarantee that if you turned up and started recommending an initial EICR or factoring in sorting out the neutral problem you would be treated with suspicion and not get the work. Most customers with an ounce of common sense will get 3 quotes and its almost always either the cheapest or the one that can start first that gets the job. If you have the luxury of sticking rigidly to the letter of the law then good for you I say, but you wouldn't get many CU changes round my neck of the woods. That's life, as Ester used to say.
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