new installation - started under 16th edition, finished under 17th?

[jjrideon]

Hi,

I would really appreciate some advice on a complete rewire I've recently had done of my house as part of a complete back to brickwork refurbishment.

The work commenced back in Jan 2008, but was only completed in March 2009 due to all sorts of problems with the main contractor.
I've received the installation & test certs, as well as building reg approval now and thought everything was fine.

British Gas electricians came out to fix a minor problem as part of a homecare agreement and pointed out that not all the circuits were RCD protected as they should be under the current regs. I assumed that this was because the installation was designed to the 16th edition regs and therefore it was OK to finish it off to that standard. However, I went and checked the cert's and they state BS7671:2008 which is the 17th edition regs.

I spoke to the main contractor's electrician who first of all tried to say everything was done correctly, then when I pointed out that I agreed it was, but maybe the paperwork was just filled in wrong and could he sort it out he just muttered about opening a can of worms and everything was fine, he stood by his work, he wasn't going anywhere etc. etc..

So what would you advise me to do? What should the paperwork say? I just want to make sure everything is above board!

Thanks for your help.
JJ

 

[Mark.W]

Well if the work doesn't conform to 17th ed Wiring regs then he can't indicate that on the cert. When was the work done? Is he registered with a scheme? If so then threaten to phone the scheme!

 

[jjrideon]

The work was started in Jan 2008, but only finished in March 09, so it overlapped the change over in regs. He is registered with NICEIC and I did say I might need to get them involved which is what led to his 'opening a can of worms' comment...

 

[sparks1234]

Ask him for the NIC number so you can ring them....he might get his backside into gear. I am not sure on the what the overlap period was going from the 16th to 17th but even so if there are no RCD then it should be signed off as 16th if the time period is acceptable

 

[Mark.W]

I'm sorry but when he signed the cert, he was saying that the installation complied with the 17th ed wiring regs, which it clearly hasn't! Best thing to do is give NIC a call, explain your concern. As sparks said ask him to give you the tel no. that way he will know you are serious! If he doesn't I will give you the no.

 

[xraytek]

The work was started in Jan 2008, but only finished in March 09, so it overlapped the change over in regs. He is registered with NICEIC and I did say I might need to get them involved which is what led to his 'opening a can of worms' comment...

As long as your not the one picking up worms, then I dont see why you should worry

 

[Risteard]

Ask him for the NIC number so you can ring them....he might get his backside into gear. I am not sure on the what the overlap period was going from the 16th to 17th but even so if there are no RCD then it should be signed off as 16th if the time period is acceptable

An installation designed to the 16th Edition would be installed to the 16th Edition. So long as it was designed to the 16th Edition within the appropriate timescale then it can be installed to the 16th Edition despite the 17th Edition since having come into force. It only applies to installations designed after the cut-off date.

Therefore, something designed to the 16th Edition a little over a year ago can still legitimately be installed to the 16th Edition.

But, as has been said, it could not possibly be inspected, tested and certified to the 17th Edition.

 

[Mark.W]

An installation designed to the 16th Edition would be installed to the 16th Edition. So long as it was designed to the 16th Edition within the appropriate timescale then it can be installed to the 16th Edition despite the 17th Edition since having come into force. It only applies to installations designed after the cut-off date.

Therefore, something designed to the 16th Edition a little over a year ago can still legitimately be installed to the 16th Edition.

But, as has been said, it could not possibly be inspected, tested and certified to the 17th Edition.

Then a 16th ed cert should have been issued!! You cannot issue a 17th cert to 16th install......!!

 

[Risteard]

Then a 16th ed cert should have been issued!! You cannot issue a 17th cert to 16th install......!!

Absolutely agree. That's why I said that obviously it cannot be inspected, tested and certified to the 17th Edition but only the 16th Edition.

 

[jjrideon]

thanks for your replies.

until i spoke to him, i actually didn't think it was a big deal - as far as i can tell everything has been done correctly to the 16th edition regs. so i just thought it was a case of a mistake on the paperwork - all he would have to do i presume is change the box where he has filled in '2008' after bs7671 to '2001' (i think, but obviously you guys would know if it wasn't that straight forward?)

but his evasiveness has obviously got me concerned! i don't want to get anyone in trouble unnecessarily but...

 

[Mark.W]

No, he cannot back date a cert to the previous regs. He has only got one option, and that is to make sure your installation complies with the current regulations, what he should have done is explained to you that the regs have changed and that it would incur more cost.

 

[Risteard]

But it was obviously designed to the 16th Edition, entirely legitimately. The only problem is that he has attempted to certify to the 17th rather than 16th.

 

[Spudnik]

I think it may need to be certified to the 17th and all the deviations marked on the cert.

 

[Sintra]

I have recently tested an installation which started in May 2008 and finished in July 2009. This installation was designed and installed to the 16th. As it was designed to the 16th it had to be tested to the 16th and a 16th EIC issued.