NICEIC Certification Scheme NICEIC release their 'Vision For The Building Regulations'

[IQ Electrical]

Here we go, mandatory scheme membership amongst other gems!

http://niceic.com/Uploads/File4079.pdf

 

[Phil]

i am trying to study here and then you throw me a red rag to the bull!!

where should i start?

"Competent Persons Schemes:
NICEIC believe that the introduction of Competent Persons Schemes has reduced the
burden on local authority resources and has improved the standard of building work in
dwellings significantly"

not in the houses i have inspected in recent times.
some may have been a little put off by undertaking the work but not many. i think more electricians have been put off rather than members of the public. the amount of guys i know that have gone commercial or ind instead of domestic because of the so called part p.

 

[IQ Electrical]

Sorry Phil, I had no idea this subject was so sensitive

 

[Phil]

There has been a reduction in the number of unregulated persons undertaking electrical
work in dwellings in England and Wales Says who?? no figures to back this up. how could you possibly know if the amount of unregistered people were still doing works? i suppose a survey at the sheds maybe would give an indication (not)
just because more people are joining the schemes does not mean more people complying.
maybe the increase in people joining could be more fast track courses selling membership as part of the course?

the way i read it all about the figures of mony saving for local auth they are giving the government the bullet they are looking for in the cost cutting exercise? lets chuck a few £ note equations at the gov and they will think umm thats a bit more off the deficit and maybe keep the part p going? running scared maybe as the gov are on about getting rid of certain red tape from local auth. also UKAS? what? they are responsible for a hell of a lot of finding students a place at uni and as much gripes we may have over the jib i know which one i would rather tell someone what i am able to do given my quals and experience

 

[Phil]

Sorry Phil, I had no idea this subject was so sensitive

only kidding mate, i am not shooting the messenger but the springs coiled now and just having a good old pick at the proposal it`s mainly the way it has been mis handled that rattles my cage. the public do not have a clue about it and when they do its a publicised view that has been passed on by a scheme for their own benefit. now i am not saying the schemes should not promote themselves far from it. lets face it they are in business like a lot of us to do just that. the advertising of it should be handled by someone outside the schemes and delivered in a clear and consise manner so the general home owner and even local auth can understand and also so they can see that there is not just one particular provider that can do it.

 

[Des 56]

What a load of bull
Thats a very distorted and unrepresentative view of what is fact

Again the voice and opinion of electricians has been dismissed and put to one side
The compilers of that report ought to be ashamed of it, to the same extent that collabarators of the nazis were to the truth in those times

 

[Phil]

oh found a bit i do agree with
"Evidence is that the large majority of the general public are not aware of the requirements
of Building Regulations or understand the concept of Competent Persons Schemes. This
needs to be addressed and more public awareness carried out to promote the benefits of
using a competent installer to carry out work covered by the Building Regulations."
got to admit this is true, and who`s fault is it? certainly not ours. there also is a lot of mis informaton out there. how the hell do we expect the public to understand it when the vast amount of local auth don`t ? and furthermore "the electricians"? how many posts on here are for sparks who don`t fully understand it? the answer is "plenty"

 

[IQ Electrical]

Sorry Des, is that a yay or a nay then?

 

[Phil]

Action:
Consider having a single set of requirements covering all government schemes for work
in dwellings. Ensure that the government requirements of all schemes for dwellings are the
responsibility of one government Department.
umm i wonder who may be overseeing this one? answers on a post card

 

[IQ Electrical]

Yes, I agree with the awareness bit but why the he'll should the schemes pay to publicise Part P any more than accountants should pay to publicise self assessment?

Maybe they could divert 10% of the cost of those silly self assessment adverts towards some Part P awareness campaigns?

 

[brucelee]

just another extension of the scam are they getting worried that more and more are joining elecsa rather than them

 

[IQ Electrical]

just another extension of the scam are they getting worried that more and more are joining elecsa rather than them

To be honest Bruce, I think they are concerned that the government could scrap Part P.

Look how quickly HIP's went, twitchy bum time for the scheme providers?

 

[Phil]

To be honest Bruce, I think they are concerned that the government could scrap Part P.

Look how quickly HIP's went, twitchy bum time for the scheme providers?

thats exactly how i read it. a little like getting the net out before your pushed. the report is soley geared up for putting forward how much money can be saved for local gov, which we all know is at the heart of the govs spending reviews at the moment. give the gov a money saving exercise and its sold . part p if done properley could have given the electrical trade the tools it needed to stamp out some of the bad work and also some of the have a go diy work carried out with the mentality of "it works whats wrong with it?" but unfortunately it seemed to go down the road of generating cash and scheme memberships. i remember reading an article in PE regarding a guy whos mate rang him for advice on a inspection by the largest scheme provider. his words back to the electrician after his assessment was "wow thats easy i have paid my money and are fully qualified now" the guy did not have a clue and was not fully qualified, but now in the eyes of a customer he is "NIC`ed" unfortunately a lot of the councils now only recognise one scheme and will not let others do works. i got asked to do a pir for a council owned shop and because i was not a nic member they would not accept the certs and told him he had to employ a nic electrician, thats madness. if say you was nic one week and then went to another scheme would you be any the less competent? i think not.

 

[brucelee]

Hi IQ
well if they are going to scrap it wish they would do it soon its caused nothing but aggravation for electricians and people like me who are trying to get into it legally after being involved with electrical installation for 24 yrs

wether the work i did was on site for a firm or as a foreigner on the cheap i have always done the best i could no one has ever complained of my work no one electrocuted through my work and i havent burnt nothing down
I paid £5000 so far to get the basic quals i have including 2391 and then get told i need 2330 and 2356 to get jib or be taken seriously by other electricians or employers
and when i try to get on 2330 i find out they are ending it and changing it all including the requirments for enrollment of new qual so if i cant get on 2357 are thay going to give me my £5000 back dont think so
at the end of the day its just another tax on law abiding citizens and the people who are doing it on the side will continue to do so as the customers coulnt give a monkeys about part p only getting the job done as cheaply as possible
NIC as far as i am concerned are the worst of the bodies from all the posts i have read and i would never consider joining them the only ones i would consider are elecsa as when i ring they are extremely helpful unlike nic when i contacted them

and the cost of notification through labc is even more a joke and they dont even know whats required or by who so if they cant explain it to us then what chance do we have
the joker who came up with part p should be shot at dawn along with all politicians as they are the biggest jokers

 

[Phil]

i bet this thread ends up with better recomdation for the government of the on the policing and implementation of our trade than the scheme providers can put forward. maybe more policies should be taken on the back of people involved directly in the trade than people behind the desks of whom have a different lets say monentary agenda than we do. i am sure 99% of us agree there needs to be something in place but i am also sure a great number would agree that part p is not the way and the way it has been done certainly has failed the people it was designed to protect.