part p and 17th questions

[happydude303]

I m in my first year of my three to become a fully qualifed electrician , but im frankly quite stump at how i will not be able to work in houses unless i do this part p course which it seems to me to be a liscence to print money, if ive done three years of learning and working , to the 17th then surley ill be more qaulifed then some one who has not doen this but just done a quick night course on the part p and then done the 17th, my collage teacher john L thinks this is a big joke and so do i , i am new to this forum and new to this industry but can some tell me why the above is the case becuase what i will have to do is spend the best part of four grand getting qualifed then spend more money on the part p and then money on the 17th when im being trained to the regs any way

 

[malcolmsanford]

Ahhhhhhhhhhh welcome to the wonderful world of electrickery, there are many of us also pondering why this is.

Basically though for work that is deemed notifiable by the Local building control under Part P of the regulations you will either have to inform them before you start work, then depending on their take on your competency they will inform you what you need to do and what it will cost you.

If though you join a competent persons self certification scheme you can by pass all of the above do the work and the scheme will do the rest .

Bet you glad you chose electric eh

 

[happydude303]

yeah and i was thinking about plumbing, sao i take it that most sparks think it is a bit of a P!ss take

 

[malcolmsanford]

yeah and i was thinking about plumbing, sao i take it that most sparks think it is a bit of a P!ss take

I think that is a safe assumption

 

[fuzzydunlop]

I still haven't qualified and find it amazing the whole "competent" persons schemes are allowed.

Even though they're being tightened up next year its very much a case of locking the stable door after the horse has bolted. After the fight is over with the Big 8, electricians should focus their anger at the Govt and get a proper scheme in place (like Gas Safe)

 

[GLENNSPARK]

Ahhhhhhhhhhh welcome to the wonderful world of electrickery, there are many of us also pondering why this is.

Basically though for work that is deemed notifiable by the Local building control under Part P of the regulations you will either have to inform them before you start work, then depending on their take on your competency they will inform you what you need to do and what it will cost you.

If though you join a competent persons self certification scheme you can by pass all of the above do the work and the scheme will do the rest .

Bet you glad you chose electric eh

Yeah well why it is ....is £450-£500 per year (with notifyables on top of course).............It cant be about competency as some of the stuff we come across by these 6 week wonders is total crap..........

 

[clicon357]

Just to reiterate as I think the OP might have missed it..........having "Part P" IS NOT the licence to print money some people think and having just Part P doesn't allow you "work in houses". You must still sign up with one of the (what is it six?) competent persons schemes like NICEIC, NAPIT, ELECSA etc. There was a guy advertising his sparking services in our local freebie paper for months as "Part P Qualified" someone must have pointed out the issue and he joined ELECSA and changed the advert.

I know it's an emotive subject this so apologies if I ruffle anyones feathers. To quote from my own experience I'm a (mature) apprenticed mehanical engineer who over the years at work found myself doing more and more electrical work without any real formal training. I then became a private landlord (long story) renting a house out. As a "decent" landlord I had the gas and electrics checked and even I knew that the first firm of sparks we got in to do the inspection / Periodic were trying to rip us off. Pre Part P I'd done a couple of re-wires and always dabbled which led to the "Surely, you could have done that?" comments from the wife. On the back of all that I signed up for a Part P course at North West Kent College. Not to make any money as such but just to be able to do my own, friends, family's electrical work etc. I was expecting to be able to self certify based on what the enrolment guy had told me. Soon realised that I would also have to join a competency scheme. It was a year (35 weeks), 2 evenings a week, one night practical and the other theory. I can honestly say I learnt a lot and would say that that particular Part P course was a good one. Thereafter I signed up and have just finished, this year, my Level 3 2330. During that time I also took and passed the 17th. I was at college with guys who paid top money for one of these 2 or 3 day Part P courses and to be honest it showed.

I wrote to my local Building Control asking where they "stand" on all this - IT DOES VARY FROM COUNCIL TO COUNCIL and it even says this in the Part P Approved Document. They wrote back saying as long as I can prove competency then they will accept my doing the work and testing, signing off. I will however still have to pay the £150 or whatever it is per job to the council if its notifiable. Though I've yet to find which one I've been told there is one of them (ELECSA maybe?) who for something like £200 a year let you do something like 8 notifiable jobs per year. You can do more on a pay as you go type thing. Anyone know about this as it would suit me? It is I believe something that let's say college lecturers to the odd outside notifiable sparking job even though sparking isn't as such their main job.

Thanks for reading and hope that all makes sense and maybe helps the OP. So glad to have found this forum - I tried Screwfix's one - NEVER AGAIN!

 

[clicon357]

I'm feeling all embarrassed now that I missed the "c" out of "mechanical" :smile5:

 

[Sparky Ninja]

You need to go to night school and learn to SPELL

You join back in April and choose that to be your first post. How pointless.

 

[DurhamSparky]

sad really the people who lurk around the forums looking to start arguments..!

 

[EastAnglian]

In defence of Part P please be aware that the training and examination is about compliance with Building Regulations - it is not an electrical qualification as such. It is therefore different from what you learn by simply swallowing the regs for tea!

One small example ..... where you can/can't notch a joist and where you can/can't drill through one. BS7671 is silent on this subject, but Building Regs Part A is where you find the info, and this is an element of the Part P training.

Sure, you learn the same thing in 3 years of Electro-tech ..... but don't simply dismiss the whole Part P idea on the heresay of others.

 

[DurhamSparky]

part p sux!!!

never done the course never will do the course!! its pointless..!

 

[clicon357]

I hate this when a reasonable thread threatens to get hijacked and taken off topic for very little. OK so the OP's spelling left a little to be desired but the content of his message deserved some positive feedback / comment. Maybe a gentle or even private message explaining how to use the spell check. I agree it makes reading the post much easier if the spelling is good but it's not worth having a dig. Again, I'd even venture that good diction and spelling is a must when dealing with customers. Seriously, I forgot to use spell check when I posted above and was mortified about missing out the "c" above! Let's get back on topic!

 

[EastAnglian]

I've clocked over 30 years in the electrical & electronic industry and I learnt new stuff when I did my Part P training.

 

[Guest112]

the on site guide mentions maximum hole sizes cut in joists i think it was an eight of the joist height was the max ( 0.125 times the joist height)