PME Swimming Pool, Pond, and Jaccuzi

[Billythekid]

Went to look at a job the other day,

The customer wants some "electrics" installed for his swimming pool, pond, and jacuzzi. Had a quick look at the existing Jacuzzi supply: this is tapped off of main tails (henley blocks), into Seperate RCD enclosure with 40A MCB. Unable to locate bonding conductor (although could be a core of the SWA). The Jacuzzi has been installed on decking with DPC, so this concerns me much less than the pond, and more importantly the pool.

The pond is fed via an extension lead ran from conservatory (obviously within a suitably rated enclosure - a carrier bag ), this then feeds the pumps, and another extension lead for swimming pool pumps (atleast these are enclosed within a shed). So i'm now faced with quoting this mess, I fear this install may be on extension leads for some time to come. How can the pool contractor just accept this install? Surely they should advise of the potential risks? He said they commissioned their pumps with the same setup!?!?!? :53: Flagstone slabs around pool, installed straight on ground with minimal concrete. Hopefully enough train brake dust will form - train tracks around 5mtrs from shed (pump house) and pool, and create a barrier from earth?

The supply is a 100A PME, the pond is circa 65mtrs from this, and pool around 90mtrs.

Maybe I should just clip his lead and fit a weatherproof socket, what do you think? :2guns:

 

[malcolmsanford]

Well you can have a PME supply to a swimming pool, reg 702.410.3.4.3 but there are quite strict restrictions to this.

As you going out such a distance and if you did decide to extend the equipotential zone out, then you have a lot of issues with bonded and getting back to the main MET, mainly cable and sizes. Personally I would TT this installation

 

[Billythekid]

Well you can have a PME supply to a swimming pool, reg 702.410.3.4.3 but there are quite strict restrictions to this.

As you going out such a distance and if you did decide to extend the equipotential zone out, then you have a lot of issues with bonded and getting back to the main MET, mainly cable and sizes. Personally I would TT this installation

I don't think i'll be touching this in all honesty, he's not going to pay for it when he has something that works now (albeit completely wrong, "but the pumps and pretty lights work"). All I can do is issue a quote, and try to talk some sense into them.

Regards

 

[malcolmsanford]

Well he must have had a reason for asking you to quote, either it's to get an idea of cost or he wants to do it properly.

Whatever it was it means you have a chance of work and well a sniff is better than none, so can only advise be honest to both him and yourself

 

[Engineer54]

Agree with Malcolm, the distance's here really prohibits extending the equipotential zone, so it's going to be all down to providing a ''Good'' TT system.

...If this is a standard below ground concrete swimming pool, have a look in the the pool control panel and around the pool for evidence of earthing the pools re-bar (Ufer earthing). As any half decent pool installer will have made such a connection. Or at the very least a couple of earth rods. If present, connect to any earth rods you may install at the EMT.

So what size was these extension leads supplying the pool and pond then?? lol!!

 

[Billythekid]

Well he must have had a reason for asking you to quote, either it's to get an idea of cost or he wants to do it properly.

Whatever it was it means you have a chance of work and well a sniff is better than none, so can only advise be honest to both him and yourself

Absolutely, not turning my nose up to any work, just don't think he realises how expensive it's going to be.

I was actually there to look at a lean-to that he wanted a few sockets and a light in, somehow we managed to get talking about fish?!? (don't ask, I can't recall). That's when he mentioned the "electrics" to his pool and pond. As said I'll quote this work, that's as far as I can go without scaremongery. I've explained the potential risks already, so I wont be going back over that.

Thanks and regards

Billy

 

[Billythekid]

Agree with Malcolm, the distance's here really prohibits extending the equipotential zone, so it's going to be all down to providing a ''Good'' TT system.

...If this is a standard below ground concrete swimming pool, have a look in the the pool control panel and around the pool for evidence of earthing the pools re-bar (After eating). As any half decent pool installer will have made such a connection. Or at the very least a couple of earth rods. If present, connect to any earth rods you may install at the EMT. I couldn't see any earthing rods/cables/labels???

So what size was these extension leads supplying the pool and pond then?? lol!!

Only standard 50/25mtr reels (1.5mm2 ish). The Pumps are only small for pond (so i'm told), and 450w/280w for pool.

He also mentioned a summer house, with kettle (another can of worms). Think i need a revisit to confirm exactly what it is that he's planning for this. On the face of it this would seem an ideal location (between pond and pool) for the TT'd Consumer unit. I'm not convinced that the shed is a suitable location (standard shiplap with felt thrown over), of course anything is possible - but gets more expensive.

All input appreciated gents

Regards

Billy

 

[Engineer54]

Only standard 50/25mtr reels (1.5mm2 is). The Pumps are only small for pond (so i'm told), and 450w/280w for pool.

He also mentioned a summer house, with kettle (another can of worms). Think i need a revisit to confirm exactly what it is that he's planning for this. On the face of it this would seem an ideal location (between pond and pool) for the TT'd Consumer unit. I'm not convinced that the shed is a suitable location (standard shiplap with felt thrown over), of course anything is possible - but gets more expensive.

All input appreciated gents

Regards

Billy

Bit of volt drop there i would think!! lol!!

Never seen a pool pump smaller than 1HP, so i'm unsure about the 2 figures you give above, why 2??
What sort of size is the pool, a standard 7m X 3m or 8m X 4m or is it larger or smaller??

 

[Billythekid]

Bit of volt drop there i would think!! lol!!

Never seen a pool pump smaller than 1HP, so i'm unsure about the 2 figures you give above, why 2??
What sort of size is the pool, a standard 7m X 3m or 8m X 4m or is it larger or smaller??

Indeed, the pond pumps are constantly run, with the pool pumps on individual (plug in type) timers. To be perfectly honest I was a bit confused as to why there were two, and their sizes so different? The rating plate of larger pump is 450w and the smaller 280w. The pool is a bit of a strange size/layout. At a guess i'd say 6m x 2-2.5 with a crescent at the shallow end (almost like half a paddling pool). Perhaps there are jets at the crescent end (smaller pump maybe), it was difficult to see as the pool was dirty.

Regards

Billy