Reconnecting old wiring.

[hydeselec]

Hi all,

I am looking at a potential job at the moment it is a barn conversion on a farm, All the mains boards are in the barn at the moment that supply the farm house.

Some of the wiring is the old cotton wound cables into the old MEM fuse boards with porcelain fuses. These obviously need moving ....

Do i...

A. move and reconnect in old board ?
B. Tell them they need the farm house re wiring?
C. Reconnect in a new board ?

Any other suggestions welcome ...........:santa3:​

 

[Guest111]

If you tell them the whole lot need rewiring at once then they could think you are just after more work,If it was me I would advise them that it needs attention and take your wiring from a new board,without touching the old stuff and noting on paperwork that you have told them what needs doing,on the other hand they may want the lot done at once,its your client so you know them better than me,hope this helps.

 

[Guitarist]

So you are considering taking the old rewirable boards down and putting them up elsewhere?

 

[RISElectrical]

Thing to remember is that you are responsible for the work you carry out and that work has to comply with current regulations.

 

[Knobhead]

If they won’t have a rewire, walk a very long way away.

Mind you I’d love to see the paperwork to cover the job.

 

[hydeselec]

guitarist I am not really considering anything at this moment in time my thread is purely based on other people opinions on the matter

But hypothetically yes it is an option to unscrew the board and move it.

The boards in question need moving as it is in the location of the new dwelling and its what supplies a farm house. As they have sold the Barn to a client its going to be hard to say " hey i know you sold your barn but now you need your house rewiring!"

Isn't there a regulation stating you can "re-connect" old wiring with no earth so long as everything is Class 2 and labelled correctly ?

It is a tough situation because no matter who does the job they are going to have to do something with these old rewireable fuse boards........

 

[SPARTYKUS]

With the description of the wiring (cotton!), and assuming you will be working to elec at work regs, you'll presumably be de-energizing the fuse board before moving?


So....who's responsible for the installation when you re energize it?



I hope this clears it up for you!

 

[hydeselec]

so you are saying that if you de-energize a supply then re energize it you are responsible for that installation passed the point of isolation ?

 

[RISElectrical]

If you move the supply then yes to an extent, or that's at least my belief. Just de-energising and re-energising isn't committing to responsibility, however if your moving the boards, altering the cables etc etc then you would have to issue a certificate for this, and therefore would have to state the deviations from the regulations on the cert. or this is how I see it anyway

 

[hydeselec]

Yes i understand where you are coming from now. Any more suggestions ....

 

[SPARTYKUS]

If you move the supply then yes to an extent, or that's at least my belief. Just de-energising and re-energising isn't committing to responsibility, however if your moving the boards, altering the cables etc etc then you would have to issue a certificate for this, and therefore would have to state the deviations from the regulations on the cert. or this is how I see it anyway

If you re energize an installation & it was not safe, and something happened, it can and will be your fault. You switched it on!

 

[RISElectrical]

That can't always be the rule. For example, if you de-energised a whole installation for purpose of testing etc or just to install an MCCB in the main sub section board (for example to install a dedicated fire alarm supply). Then you re-energise you do not take responsibility for all the sub mains and sub circuits fed on the system.

If this is the case as you say then for me to install said fire alarm supply I have in effect taken responsibility for all circuits in a large factory? You only take responsibility for the circuits worked on or altered. If however you can clearly see something of a dangerous nature then it is your responsibility to make this safe.

 

[SPARTYKUS]

Yes, a good point, its more complicated than I made out but then Im good at simplifying things.....

 

[GLENNSPARK]

If you re energize an installation & it was not safe, and something happened, it can and will be your fault. You switched it on!

yeah.exactly....just read this thread ....cant believe it.......reconnecting to old fabric covered cable/s....shifting C/Us about that sound like there from WW1 or sommat....come on!!.....

 

[GLENNSPARK]

i mean..if it needs rewiring...and the client wont see it......time to hit the road....fast!....

 

[RISElectrical]

My point was that if the op is installing a new cu, and the new cu is up to current regs, including the supply tails etc then he wouldn't have direct responsibility for other areas of the installation. However if he moves, connects into, adapts or alters the original installation then if it is unsafe or needs upgrading this would have to be also up to standard.

In no way way I saying that any of what the op suggested about moving the items would be ok and like I said I would probably walk away if the client wouldn't agree to my design and upgrades that I recommended.

In simplified form, Remember your only giving a cert for the work you do. Like changing a cu only, so long as the cert states cu change only that's all your liable for.

 

[sedgy34]

"hydeselec"
Nice job to get but deffinately recomend rewire afterall its a refurb, and you need to comply to 17th edition

 

[GLENNSPARK]

if you start putting RCDs in here.....with old cable/s....well i dont need to go any further do i....

 

[sedgy34]

Ris
As you know before you change a consumer unit you should test all circuits and upgrade the equipotential earthing arrangements so you know if you introduce an rcd in the new db you wont have any faults to find, also all testing is to be done to all exhisting circuits this is when reccomentdations come into play and and exhisting cables in such state need to be renewed.

 

[RISElectrical]

Indeed but I was talking about if the OP installed a new board for his work, and didn't touch the other consumer units the he wouldn't be taking responsibility for them and could highlight that they required attention thus covering his arse so to speak. Your not telling me that in a multi consumer unit environment if you changed or added a board you'd test the whole installation?

 

[Guest111]

bit groggy last night, thought he was on about adding new wiring to board,definately have to replace old stuff or walk away if you were looking to connect in new circuits then as I said new board on its own but trying to do anything with the old stuff NO you could be leaving yourself wide open for a lot of grief.

 

[GLENNSPARK]

you test/verefy the work YOU DID.....thats the reason why we use add-on boards sometimes....but if you are replacing an old C/U for new....but utilising the existing wireing....then you really should ensure that the existing wireing being fed from the new C/U is still good for continued service....by both inspection and testing....as has been pointed out earlier in this thread....its old fabric covered cable....i wouldn`t even bother subjecting something that old to any continuity or dielectric tests......

 

[sedgy34]

No! only the board you replace and the circuits connected to it, these circuits You would be resonsible for. i think some how we went off the topic

 

[Octopus]

The best place to start would be an EICR for the entire installation.

That, or walk away.

 

[sedgy34]

that is correct