Sole Trader-Taking On Extra Labour

P

poirot

As the title reads, how do you employ someone to help at busy periods.

Are there any forum members who can offer some guidance on how to hire temporary labour, I am a sole trader so seeking advice on insurances, payment and any other points that are required etc. Any advice would be grately apprieciated.

Thanks in advance.
 
Well, you could just subcontract, then it's pretty much up to them what tax and insurance they pay. I think.
 
I used to request an invoice and just leave it up to them.

You could look at CIS and pay their tax at source

Or bit the bullet and do what I have now done and go the PAYE route, believe it or not they have been quite helpful!
 
I just sub contract to other self employed sparks. You have to register with cis as a contractor and verify them to see what level of deduction is to be made(usually 20%). Then when they invoice you give them a statement showing the deduction. Then every month you do a monthly return showing what you have deducted and pay the taxman.

The only downside is that you need to do a monthly return every month regardless of whether you have any sub contract labour or not. A late return is an immediate £100 fine.

The cis were actually pretty helpful when I was setting this up.
 
Hi Rocker, Cbw & DS

Thanks for your replies, So with the cis route i register as a contractor make reductions then complete monthly returns, Whats involved with the monthly returns, is it a case of sending records in each month or can you keep records and notify by phone monthly. As this may be a one off at the moment am i able to just take an invoice and pay without taking deductions or does it have to be the cis route. What are my responsabilitys depending on either route, is it advisable to have some kind of contract.
 
WTF!!!! who is durhamspark!!!!

and CBW i aint bloody ginger!! we had this discussion.....
 
The monthly retuns are just a form to be filled in each month showing how much you have deducted and who from. Don't think it's too advisable to do it without taking deductions if the work falls into the scope of the cis which it most likely will do. You can register to do the returns online and when you have not paid any subcontractors you make a nil return. Give the cis helpline a call and they will go through the process with you.That's what I did and registered as a contractor/employer over the phone.
 
poirot said:
As the title reads, how do you employ someone to help at busy periods.

Are there any forum members who can offer some guidance on how to hire temporary labour, I am a sole trader so seeking advice on insurances, payment and any other points that are required etc. Any advice would be grately apprieciated.

Thanks in advance.
Click to expand...

Unless you can pretty well guarantee yourself that you can pay someone through thick and thin mate, just use guys on a sub contract basis - as said, there are two ways of doing that - ask them to raise an invoice on you after the work, or deduct their tax via CIS (which the IR will want you to do if you're using a volume of sub labour).

You can still buy materials, and you just account for the labour as sub-contract, or casual labour - the materials in the same way as for any other job.

Least pain route is to ask them for an invoice.
 
DurhamSparky said:
WTF!!!! who is durhamspark!!!!

and CBW i aint bloody ginger!! we had this discussion.....
Click to expand...


Sorry mate, didn't realise when I registered that there was anyone with a username almost identical. If there's a way of changing my username I don't mind doing it if you would prefer.
 
shut it st johns ambulance!!!

keep the user name mate might deflect some of the tripe that gets sent my way from the jokers on here!!

high tower i have your number!!! you need to advertise your services some where!! lol...! just wait till im on a boring night shift!
 
Thanks DS2

So once i register with CIS as a contractor/employer what insurances are required, would i be right in saying employers liability insurance? How much does this cost roughly.
 
DurhamSparky said:
shut it st johns ambulance!!!

keep the user name mate might deflect some of the tripe that gets sent my way from the jokers on here!!

high tower i have your number!!! you need to advertise your services some where!! lol...! just wait till im on a boring night shift!
Click to expand...

We all learnt our antics from you!! You are the chief tripe giver!!
 
I did not at that point have employers liability as they are self employed contractors.

I do now as employing PAYE......Looking through my files and cannot find it, just added it to my public liability
 
poirot said:
Thanks DS2

So once i register with CIS as a contractor/employer what insurances are required, would i be right in saying employers liability insurance? How much does this cost roughly.
Click to expand...

No, you won't need employers - but you will need to carry sufficient public liability. In any of the cases, your subbies will need to carry their own PL insurance too, which you should keep a copy of and check periodically.

When you register under CIS you effectively become a tax agent, and no more. You are undertaking to pay tax on behalf of those employed by you on a casual basis - the sole purpose of which is so the revenue lose less income from those not declaring their income properly.

The whole reason for the scheme was to try to eliminate cash in hand work....i.e. by making those further up the food chain a little more culpable.

Again, unless you intend to use labour in this way consistently, there's no benefit unless the work you're getting them to do falls entirely within the scope of the CIS scheme.
 
Hi Bill,

So if it was a one off i should be fine just to pay an invoice without making any deductions, but if work got to a stage where i was using a sub contractor on a regular basis i would need to register with cis.
 
poirot said:
Hi Bill,

So if it was a one off i should be fine just to pay an invoice without making any deductions, but if work got to a stage where i was using a sub contractor on a regular basis i would need to register with cis.
Click to expand...

Yes, essentially - if the work falls within the scope of the CIS scheme.

Occasionals are not an issue - it's when you're using labour extensively in this way on work within the scope of the CIS.

Mostly that's site work, big installs, etc. For small works, it won't really be an issue, or with domestics and so forth.

As others have said - the CIS help line are pretty helpful, and can tell you if the work you're planning/volume is within scope or not.
 
accordfire said:
Yes, essentially - if the work falls within the scope of the CIS scheme.

Occasionals are not an issue - it's when you're using labour extensively in this way on work within the scope of the CIS.

Mostly that's site work, big installs, etc. For small works, it won't really be an issue, or with domestics and so forth.

As others have said - the CIS help line are pretty helpful, and can tell you if the work you're planning/volume is within scope or not.
Click to expand...

This is how I understand it as well, and I also don't have employers insurance as they are responsible for their own insurances as self employed tradesman.

When I called the cis I explained that it was infrequent ( a couple of weeks in 1 case) and was told I needed to register on the scheme.
 
Last edited by a moderator:
the CIS Scheme from what I gather requires that if you use a subby and he solely works for you for longer than 6 months then you must take him PAYE ( ie pay IR MORE tax) one of the firms local to me have 2 firms they swap subbies inbetween the CIS route also saves on employers NI and Holidaypay ect
 
mogga said:
the CIS Scheme from what I gather requires that if you use a subby and he solely works for you for longer than 6 months then you must take him PAYE ( ie pay IR MORE tax) one of the firms local to me have 2 firms they swap subbies inbetween the CIS route also saves on employers NI and Holidaypay ect
Click to expand...

Your right there mogga.

Plus pretty sure you have to file a CIS return every month, regardless and if you miss it then roll on the fines.

The way I do it is do the work for a fellow trademan then give em an invoice for the work done.

Nice and easy IMO keep it simple
 
my accountant told me that as long as the amount paid in 1 year to a person doesnt exceed £ 5000 then you can put them down as casual labour, if its more than this then you need to take their HMRC tax number from them and CIS tax off them and make monthly returns to the revenue. and issue a statement to them like a pay slip with what has been deducted.
I just request an invoice and pay them and leave the tax and ni up to them
plenty of decent chaps willing to work a week here and a week there, once you have 4 or 5 you can call on your fine even in extremely busy periods
 
I've just gone self employed and want to sub-contract to companies....
How do I register with the CIS as a contractor?
 

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Sole Trader-Taking On Extra Labour
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