Thatch Roof Wiring

[bluecallum]

Hi guys,recommendations please what is the best way of protecting cables in a roof space with a thatched roof,that has already been wired in T&E,are there any regulations,a job Ive come across today.
Regards

 

[jase]

Protecting from what?

 

[7029 dave]

I can not quote any regulation , but maybe the insurance company of the property may require an certain cabling specification such as MICC.?

 

[tomspark93]

Protecting from what?

Hungry rodents?

 

[Plonker 3]

Not having a dig at the OP here, but too often questions like this are being asked. The answer will always be the same, the wiring system and accesories should be suitable for the enviroment that they are installed in. This should be basic knowledge for any sparks, or at least easily findable in the BYB which they should have a copy of.

 

[infinity]

Just because it's thatched doesn't mean it will leak!

 

[Leesparkykent]

http://www.nsmtltd.co.uk/publications/NIE-EIC_Electrical_installations_in_Thatch_2013.pdf

here is a link to what the Dorset model has to say.

The "Dorset Model" general electrical requirements for alterations or new build thatched properties in Dorset.


Electrical Supply
If the electrical supply is from overhead lines the incoming lines must be spaced 300mm from the thatch.


RCD protection
All circuits in a thatched property should be RCD protected.


Wiring
It is possible to design electrical circuitry so that there is no wiring within the roof space, by having wall mounted instead of ceiling mounted lighting for example, and this is the best option. Do not have recessed ceiling lights on the upper floor, unless separated from the loft by 30 minutes of fire resistance, with allowance made for ventilation to prevent over-heating of the fitting. However, if wiring in the loft cannot then the following precautions are advised to minimise the likelihood of an electrical fault fire.
Squirrels, mice and rats all seem to enjoy gnawing PVC cable. Unless the loft can be made vermin free, which is difficult to guarantee with thatch, wiring should either be contained in conduit, or proof against attack itself, (e.g. steel wired armoured). Fire resisting cables are not necessarily vermin proof as they are not protected by a hard metal sheathing, (copper sheathing is comparatively soft). Metal conduit is satisfactory and good results have been reported with the use of high impact plastic pipe with a minimum diameter of 20mm. Soft plastic, or smaller diameters, would allow penetration by biting and should therefore be avoided.
Any light in the loft should be of the bulkhead or well-glass design, be sited on a central post away from the thatch and have its switch in the landing. Wiring should not be fixed to the side of rafters, to avoid possible penetration by thatching spikes/crooks, and junction boxes should be avoided so that all cable within the roof space is a continuous length.


Smoke Alarms
A domestic mains and battery powered, interlinked smoke alarm system will be required with one smoke alarm fitted in the roof void. The system should generally be in accordance with that specified in Approved Document B.


The ‘Dorset Model’ has been jointly produced by the Local Authorities across Dorset in conjunction with Dorset Fire and Rescue Service, The Dorset Master Thatchers Association and after consultation with the National Inspection Council for Electrical Installation Contracting and the British Research Establishment Ltd. On the basis that evidence has shown that thatch can be made sacrificial in the event of fire.

 

[Paul.M]

Not having a dig at the OP here, but too often questions like this are being asked. The answer will always be the same, the wiring system and accesories should be suitable for the enviroment that they are installed in. This should be basic knowledge for any sparks, or at least easily findable in the BYB which they should have a copy of.

And yet again another reply of "This is in the BYB..... people should not ask questions on a forum".

A lot of members are becoming bored of these types of replies. The OP has asked a very good question on an install that is not common and also something that is not in the Yellow book. Please inform us all of what section of the BYB covers thatched roofs in detail.

@ Leesparkykent. Thank you for your excellent post yet again. It is people like you that make this forum.

 

[Plonker 3]

And yet again another reply of "This is in the BYB..... people should not ask questions on a forum".

A lot of members are becoming bored of these types of replies. The OP has asked a very good question on an install that is not common and also something that is not in the Yellow book. Please inform us all of what section of the BYB covers thatched roofs in detail.

@ Leesparkykent. Thank you for your excellent post yet again. It is people like you that make this forum.

Well seeing as the OP adked if there was any regulations on this, I pointed them to section about it being designed according to the enviroment it is instslled in. Beyond that it is upto the designer to ensure it complies with that.

You know as well as anyone else that the regs wont give specific guidance to one particular install. So why ask for that section of the regs?

I must have seen the reply I have put 7 or 8 times in the last week on here. Like I said this is a simple point to find in the BYB. Asking for a bit of clarity is fine, but the OP has been very vague with the opening post.

 

[Deleted member 26818]

There are no specific Regulations relating to thatched premises.

 

[Paul.M]

Well seeing as the OP adked if there was any regulations on this, I pointed them to section about it being designed according to the enviroment it is instslled in. Beyond that it is upto the designer to ensure it complies with that.

You know as well as anyone else that the regs wont give specific guidance to one particular install. So why ask for that section of the regs?

I must have seen the reply I have put 7 or 8 times in the last week on here. Like I said this is a simple point to find in the BYB. Asking for a bit of clarity is fine, but the OP has been very vague with the opening post.

His opening post is clear to me. It is an already existing install with T&E in a roof space in a thatched property that he has only just come across the job today. Question/statement is :- "recommendations please what is the best way of protecting cables in a roof space with a thatched roof,that has already been wired in T&E,are there any regulations,"???

Your reply of "This should be basic knowledge for any sparks, or at least easily findable in the BYB which they should have a copy of....." This is not basic electrical knowledge nor is it find-able in the BYB to the extent of protecting existing cables in such a location. The OP has a good question and one that you can not answer so yet again you post up the bog standard "its in the BYB if you have one".... Dillb you would not believe how many people are getting bored of the same statement.

If you have nothing better to say, step away from the keyboard.

 

[Plonker 3]

Paul I have seen pictures of male nudity with comments made to support it and someone being called a knob both by members of staff on this forum in public places. I Suggest you get your own house in order before you start preaching to others, or is it one rule for one and another for the staff.

 

[Midwest]

Dillb. I've mulled over this post, yours and the others replies (and other peoples posts in other threads). I know nothing of the above thread/post on male nudity or name calling. I think you are quite right, that most if not all things are covered in BS7671 (I'm talking of electrical installations!), and if you have a query, its in there to be found. If one were able to understand every single regulation, table, figure, appendix etc in BS7671, the vast majority of this forum would be of no benefit. Forums are for discussions, which includes seeking guidance. I for one have sought and received good advice here. I agree that some of the council pursued, verges on inability, and perhaps shouldn't be entertained. The problem with scorning (and I don't say you've done this here) every such question, will make people less likely to ask. And then nobody wins.

'In vain you have acquired knowledge, if you have not imparted to others' DR