This area seems grey, can you are can't you? Part P.

[Old Town Electrics]

Hi guys, its seems everyone has differing opinions on this, including myself. From my research it seems pretty obvious that you can only carry out electrical work on somebodys house if you are part of a part p electrical scheme.
From reading the forums and speaking to local electricians it seems many think its ok to carry out non-notifiable works. A local NICEIC electrician actually told me its fine to do this kind of work.
I'm just confused as from my research it seems all work needs an electrical certificate whether it be major or minor, and to do this properly you really need to test the circuit once completed on all works? Is this just impracticle and actually on most works you just go round add the new socket and move on?
I've noticed that alot of the local electricians aren't registered with anyone so are they all breaking the law? I've spoke to various working electricians who state part P qualified with 17th regs, but when you quiz them they are not registered with anyone. Does this mean that about 50% of electricians are working illegally in the UK? Im guessing that when these non registered electricians do work they don't produce a certificate because this would essentially be providing evidence against themselves that they have done work illegally?
Would love to get to the bottom of this as i'd love to get cracking on some non-notifiable works if it was ok to do so,or is it just a grey area and always will be??

 

[Colin33]

Well, obviously, I will have nothing to do with the NIC.... Does the £288 include assessments or are they extra? Are there any other running costs? It's all new to me...been mainly working on newbuilds/renovations where building control are already involved (so no extra fee!) and they are always happy to accept my certs. Makes me wonder why people bother with the scams...

 

[Wilko]

Hi - The upfront cost includes the assessment. Other costs are insurance and up-to-date calibration certs. The inspection I had was thorough - all docs sighted and checked - implementation checked - why done that way - and the kicker "let's re-test it now" . So must show safe isolation and tests as per the good book. Hopefully I'll get the same Inspector next year and he won't have thought of new things . Other than managing the BC part, Stroma also notify the Customer of compliance and warrant the work, which would be quite reassuring to the Customer.

 

[Midwest]

Hi - The upfront cost includes the assessment. Other costs are insurance and up-to-date calibration certs. The inspection I had was thorough - all docs sighted and checked - implementation checked - why done that way - and the kicker "let's re-test it now" . So must show safe isolation and tests as per the good book. Hopefully I'll get the same Inspector next year and he won't have thought of new things . Other than managing the BC part, Stroma also notify the Customer of compliance and warrant the work, which would be quite reassuring to the Customer.

All the schemes have the same procedures, well that is my experience with Elecsa compared here with Stroma. It's all down to have much the annual 'subscription' is. Elecsa is currently £515 vat incl. Guess they may suggest they provide a better service, and national awareness. I'm not sure that's worth £227?

 

[Dave OCD]

Just to add another angle to this, before I went self employed I did a few jobs for friends and colleagues, no money changed hands of course as they all did other kinds of work for me in return. Before the first 'notifiable' job I spoke to my local Building Control office explaining my qualifications and experience, I also handed them copies of my qualification certificates. From that point on they accepted my installation certificates without quibble and perhaps more relevantly with no charge !

 

[Midwest]

Just to add another angle to this, before I went self employed I did a few jobs for friends and colleagues, no money changed hands of course as they all did other kinds of work for me in return. Before the first 'notifiable' job I spoke to my local Building Control office explaining my qualifications and experience, I also handed them copies of my qualification certificates. From that point on they accepted my installation certificates without quibble and perhaps more relevantly with no charge !

Guess your lucky there, and if it became a regular contact with your LBC, it would continue. Think the problem is with this approach is for some LBC it goes into the 'too difficult box', and some might respond as yours did, or others might just say 'computer says no'.

 

[Leesparkykent]

Guess your lucky there, and if it became a regular contact with your LBC, it would continue. Think the problem is with this approach is for some LBC it goes into the 'too difficult box', and some might respond as yours did, or others might just say 'computer says no'.

Yeah for me that would be a ball ache as I work all over Kent, Sussex, London, Surrey and Essex.

 

[Risteard]

BS7672

Is that the sequel?

 

[Colin33]

That's good then. All the jobs I've done have had them involved already with the building work so I've not tried just asking them about about an electrical installation separately. Maybe I shall try this... maybe none of us need the scams after all??

 

[Colin33]

That's good then. All the jobs I've done have had them involved already with the building work so I've not tried just asking them about about an electrical installation separately. Maybe I shall try this... maybe none of us need the scams after all??

 

[Dave OCD]

That's good then. All the jobs I've done have had them involved already with the building work so I've not tried just asking them about about an electrical installation separately. Maybe I shall try this... maybe none of us need the scams after all??

It has crossed my mind.....

 

[rolyberkin]

Competent is easy to explain or justify until someone gets injured and you are 'gripping the rail' in crown court being questioned by some barrister who is being paid 5k a day just to destroy your credibility. Think worst case scenario and you won't go far wrong, what would the average man on the Clapham omnibus think.....!

 

[The Ghost]

Of course my learned friend rolyberkin refers to the officious bystander immortalised in the case of Thompson v US, called the man in the red clapham omnibus, i.e. the average man of reasonable intelligence

 

[rolyberkin]

Of course my learned friend rolyberkin refers to the officious bystander immortalised in the case of Thompson v US, called the man in the red clapham omnibus, i.e. the average man of reasonable intelligence

Not sure about the US case but it is still a concept used in the English legal system to this day. Probably more of relevance is the case of Hall v. Brooklands Auto-Racing Club (1933) to define the standard of care a defendant must live up to in order to avoid being found negligent. When we say an area is grey it probably isn't as far as the law is concerned, we just say it is to suit our purposes, this is fine until it goes wrong and we are held to account.

Professional negligence in English Law

 

[Wilko]

Hello and Good morning ! Yes, to me its not a grey area at all. The standards we work to call for a skilled person and in my view the first place to demonstrate one possesses sufficient skills should not be in front of a judge after an incident. After recent refreshing I am aware of what I know, and what I need to confirm. Without training I wouldn't know what I didn't know, if that makes any sense prior to coffee. Cheers, David

 

[The Ghost]

I would say that being CPS certified and having experience does not always mean that work will be done as it should. I have come across many instances of very poor standard of work. I mean criminally negligent work by allegedly skilled persons issuing EIC on their work. Such as a catering business called me saying I can smell a burny smell and my ovens are not working. Their MCB for the ring circuit had literally melted down. The reason being ; Two industrial ovens at 6kw each and one dishwasher at 10 kw were wired onto the ring. Although I could rectify this I told the person to get the electrician in who certified the work and insist they correct it. They did come and and did do it properly this time. And that is by no means the first time such a situation has occured.