What to do if the customer doesn't want to pay to find/fix fault?

[wattsy]

Hi,

I've just been to replace 4 down lights downstairs where rodents had chewed the insulation off the elv side if the trannys under the tiled bathroom.

This job had to be done regardless. The IR for the circuit is 0.5Mohms L&N to E.

All the circuits are run to Jb's in the floor so it's a lift the floor job to divide the circuit and find the fault. I have advised the customer but she doesn't want to pay for the work. What more can one do?

Would you just record it on the MWC or give them a letter with the invoice stating the fault and recommend remedial work?

Thanks
Marc

 

[Paul.M]

The main thing as per the regs is that you leave it in a better state than how you found it. In this case I would record everything, all your findings, all your recommendations logged and cover your back. Might even be worth recommending that the home owner gets a pest control company in.

 

[telectrix]

Hi,

I've just been to replace 4 down lights downstairs where rodents had chewed the insulation off the elv side if the trannys under the tiled bathroom.

This job had to be done regardless. The IR for the circuit is 0.5Mohms L&N to E.

All the circuits are run to Jb's in the floor so it's a lift the floor job to divide the circuit and find the fault. I have advised the customer but she doesn't want to pay for the work. What more can one do?

Would you just record it on the MWC or give them a letter with the invoice stating the fault and recommend remedial work?

Thanks
Marc

do both. note on MWC, and also send a letter, recorded delivery.

 

[Octopus]

If rodents have chewed off the insulation on the ELV side it won't long until they move on to the main course of the circuit wiring.

I'd do a cert, highlighting the issues and wait a couple of weeks before you phone rings again.

I'm with Paul M on this, I'd recommend she gets pest control out, if she doesn't her bill for repairs could easily get out of control!

 

[nickblake]

If you have found exposed conductors and she doesnt want to pay for repairs , then its a differant matter you have no choice but to do a tempruary repair on the cables , tape up and issue a danger notification and note on there , yes i may cost here a few quid to get the repairs done but far cheaper than rebuilding her house , or worse still some one dying due to electric shock caused by exposed wiring

 

[wattsy]

Thanks for your replies.

She's had the pest control in and they've got rid of them.
The exposed conductors that were visible have been replaced which were the elv side of the trannys.

The installation is safer. But you cant realistically start pulling some ones house apart without their permission. neither can you just turn one of their circuits off.

 

[nickblake]

What i would say is reccomend a PIR , and what you could do is say you will do it for 50% cheaper if youy get the remidial works , and realy make sure that the insulation tests are very sound , rodent attack is very seriouse situation and can cause alsorts of faults and as ive mentioned fires

 

[Marvo]

neither can you just turn one of their circuits off.

If I come across a circuit that's dangerous and a real chance of causing injury or death I disconnect the circuit from the breaker and label it as hazardous with my company name a phone number as well. The way I see it is it's my responsibility to disconnect in these circumstances. If the customer reconnects then the onus is on them to defend their motivation for doing so if it ends up in court.

 

[wattsy]

If I come across a circuit that's dangerous and a real chance of causing injury or death I disconnect the circuit from the breaker and label it as hazardous with my company name a phone number as well. The way I see it is it's my responsibility to disconnect in these circumstances. If the customer reconnects then the onus is on them to defend their motivation for doing so if it ends up in court.

I know what your saying but it's all her downstairs lighting and the IR L&N to E is just over 0.5Mohms, the circuits are RCD protected so I think leaving her without lights might have been over reacting in this instance.

 

[nickblake]

Im not sure on this one but legally i dont think you are permitted to isolate supplies , once you have identified the problem , make sure if at all possible you make the dangerouse situation as safe as you can , issue a danger notification , you have a duty of care as an electrician , so switching off circuits could cause problems ie heating, lighting, = old people essencial , what you have to do is be as diplomatic and straight once the customer has signed the danger notification the onus is then transfered to them , you have done all you can , you cant force work to be done ,its hard to do , recent DN i issued was an old VIR install where the insulation was dropping off the cables ,all i could do was to say you need a rewire , dont go in that cupboard where the DNO's meters are get it done as soon as possible saw it on the friday quote given on the saturday accepted sunday cancelled all booked in jobs and started on the monday

thread regarding the DN i issued is VIR the ticking time bomb

 

[kippaxkid]

i think you would be on dodgy ground if you disconnect someone else's equipment on their own property.
You are there to carry out a task to the best of your ability within the constraints of what the customer wants you to do.
Example.
When carrying out PIR's, you cannot always isolate all circuits. It does not make it a bad job because of that, just limited. and that is why there is the box to record the agreed limitations.
Do what you can at the time, and if scaring the crap out of them fails, smile sweetly, put it all down on the MWC, and get your money.
Don't go all pious on them, as you want to be in with a chance of getting the remedial work later on.
I for one,wouldn't give it to someone who is going to have a smug look on their face when they return........

Chris

 

[Deleted member 9648]

It wasn't so long ago that the minimum IR was 0.5megs.....while the circuit does not comply, it hardly warrents disconnection and a danger notice,particularly as it has RCD protection.....As long as the cert covering the remedial work carried out identifies the problem, and states that the client was made aware ,and refused to allow it to be investigated,arses are covered.