Which way forward.....

[ManchesterGas]

Hi Guys,

Looking for an insight in which is the best way forward for me...


Background..

Always had a thing with electrics, wiring plugs etc from an early age, grandad was a spark in the navy so it must be in the blood!

Worked on vehicle electrics from the age of about 14 and then progressed into it after the first couple of full time jobs for about 4 years full time and still do a bit, can fault find and rewire a car without a problem (and properly, most work I have seen done on cars is shocking, I generally stripped it out and started again)

first couple of jobs were in IT, qualified in design and installation of systems then onto control panel building for access control.

Have been a self employed plumber for 9 years and want to broaden my skill set and target a niche market involving re-wires, re plumbs, internet based access control, security & heating in a 1 firm package.

I also have a few landlords that would like me to take on the electrical work and do the EICRs too.





I am booked on the 17th edition course next week, Would it be best to just stick to installations and do a Part P based course and get someone in for EICRs or do the 2394/5?

I am not looking to go into PV or commercial really, happy to stick to houses.

 

[SirKit Breaker]

Do the 17th edition as you have planned, then try buddy up with a local spark (you must know some being a plumber) and get him to do the EICR's but assist him, and get him to explain what is going on. Then over time you do the EICR with his supervision, once you feel competent enough and have a good understanding, then consider the 2394 and 2395 courses. You are obviously not a nugget, but don't try to run, until you have learn't to walk.

Cheers..........Howard

 

[ManchesterGas]

Thanks Howard,

I have done some house wiring before and have a good understanding of installations and am happy in my abilities to re-wire a standard house to a good standard and neatness (compared to a lot that I have seen!)

I agree that it would be a good idea to shadow a spark for the EICR's and will ask a couple that I know.

I have a re-wire that I have been asked to do when qualified and my garage to finish wiring for assessments with Elecsa (who I think I'll be going with)
I can do these both on a building notice and have my spark to check over and test. Do I need to do a full scope Part P course before this or can I just work to regs and then do the 2395 at a later date?

Thanks

Adam.

 

[SirKit Breaker]

Thanks Howard,

I have done some house wiring before and have a good understanding of installations and am happy in my abilities to re-wire a standard house to a good standard and neatness (compared to a lot that I have seen!)

I agree that it would be a good idea to shadow a spark for the EICR's and will ask a couple that I know.

I have a re-wire that I have been asked to do when qualified and my garage to finish wiring for assessments with Elecsa (who I think I'll be going with)
I can do these both on a building notice and have my spark to check over and test. Do I need to do a full scope Part P course before this or can I just work to regs and then do the 2395 at a later date?

Thanks

Adam.

Adam,

dont waste your money with anything to do with part P courses, they are a con.
If you do your electrical work in full compliance with the 17th edition regs, then by default you have complied with Part P of the building regs. I cant remember the exact phrase, but it is something along the lines of "BS7671:2008 1st amendment is the standard deemed to be a means of compliance with building regulation Part P, the Electricity at Work regulations, and so on". By all means spend £20 on the Electricians guide to the building regs book, as this is full of useful stuff related to other building regs, not just part P, because we must comply with them all.

Spend your cash on getting some more experience, and some test kit etc.

Cheers..........Howard

 

[ManchesterGas]

Cheers Howard!

I'll get some more books and get stuck into them and do some research on which test kit suits me best.

Thanks for your help!

Adam

 

[telectrix]

re. test kit. there's a megger 1553 for sale on another thread. best mft going IMO.

 

[wade88]

just been trying to find that thread again - my megger is up for re-calibration, just rang RS for a quote, to get a UKAS cert, £130....i paid £48 + VAT last time, have i missed something here

 

[telectrix]

just been trying to find that thread again - my megger is up for re-calibration, just rang RS for a quote, to get a UKAS cert, £130....i paid £48 + VAT last time, have i missed something here

so ring oscs.£57.50 done at your home/workplace.

 

[ManchesterGas]

Passed the 2382-101 today, 25 mins to do and I got 98.3%

 

[Geordie Spark]

Speaking as an old retired bloke, I would say to you & any other youngster, that the best way forward is to leave this rotten country & go somewhere where the weather is better & you're rewarded - rather than penalised - for your skill & effort.

 

[Adam W]

Sorry to put a 'negative spin' on this but it's difficult to know how 'competent' you are from what you have described - wiring a house isn't rocket science, but it's different to wiring a car, or plumbing a house, or putting together a computer system.

With all due respect there are thousands of people who have worked in IT or electronics for years and think domestic electrics is a step down, but I wouldn't let them loose on my house after a test on looking stuff up in a book.

I reckon to consider yourself 'competent' you'd need to do a recognised course such as 2330/2356, or the new 2357.
To do EICRs you'd really need to do the 2391-10 or equivalent.
If you add up the cost of all these courses, scheme registration, tools etc is it really worth spreading yourself that thin?

 

[Geordie Spark]

Sorry to put a 'negative spin' on this but it's difficult to know how 'competent' you are from what you have described - wiring a house isn't rocket science, but it's different to wiring a car, or plumbing a house, or putting together a computer system.

With all due respect there are thousands of people who have worked in IT or electronics for years and think domestic electrics is a step down, but I wouldn't let them loose on my house after a test on looking stuff up in a book.

I reckon to consider yourself 'competent' you'd need to do a recognised course such as 2330/2356, or the new 2357.
To do EICRs you'd really need to do the 2391-10 or equivalent.
If you add up the cost of all these courses, scheme registration, tools etc is it really worth spreading yourself that thin?

Is it really worth the aggravation ??

 

[morph]

well yes you have complied with part p , but building regs 2000 which are statutory state in regulation 4 you must deal with all 14 parts in shedule 1 which BS 7671 most definantly does not cover

Adam,

dont waste your money with anything to do with part P courses, they are a con.
If you do your electrical work in full compliance with the 17th edition regs, then by default you have complied with Part P of the building regs. I cant remember the exact phrase, but it is something along the lines of "BS7671:2008 1st amendment is the standard deemed to be a means of compliance with building regulation Part P, the Electricity at Work regulations, and so on". By all means spend £20 on the Electricians guide to the building regs book, as this is full of useful stuff related to other building regs, not just part P, because we must comply with them all.

Spend your cash on getting some more experience, and some test kit etc.

Cheers..........Howard

 

[ManchesterGas]

Sorry to put a 'negative spin' on this but it's difficult to know how 'competent' you are from what you have described - wiring a house isn't rocket science, but it's different to wiring a car, or plumbing a house, or putting together a computer system.

With all due respect there are thousands of people who have worked in IT or electronics for years and think domestic electrics is a step down, but I wouldn't let them loose on my house after a test on looking stuff up in a book.

I reckon to consider yourself 'competent' you'd need to do a recognised course such as 2330/2356, or the new 2357.
To do EICRs you'd really need to do the 2391-10 or equivalent.
If you add up the cost of all these courses, scheme registration, tools etc is it really worth spreading yourself that thin?

Spreading myself thin in which context?

I'm not bothered weather you think I'm competent or not either. I'll wait until I've got some pictures of work I do and you can 'assess' me then
Approved document P defines me as competent for now until I do the 2395 in the next few months. I expect the 2330 gives sound knowledge just as the plumbing courses do but it is not a requirement.

I have had to stand over qualified sparks before telling them how to wire a circuit because they had to put their name to it and wouldn't let me insert the wires into the terminals. I agree that a house is not like a car but I have an aptitude for it and enjoy it .




Geordie, Thanks but I'm settled here and have built my business up over the last 9 years without advertising and my wife has a good job. we're happy here, the grass isn't always greener!

Morph, Building regs 2000 were revoked Oct '10 - how up to date are you ?

 

[Geordie Spark]

Spreading myself thin in which context?

I'm not bothered weather you think I'm competent or not either. I'll wait until I've got some pictures of work I do and you can 'assess' me then
Approved document P defines me as competent for now until I do the 2395 in the next few months. I expect the 2330 gives sound knowledge just as the plumbing courses do but it is not a requirement.

I have had to stand over qualified sparks before telling them how to wire a circuit because they had to put their name to it and wouldn't let me insert the wires into the terminals. I agree that a house is not like a car but I have an aptitude for it and enjoy it .




Geordie, Thanks but I'm settled here and have built my business up over the last 9 years without advertising and my wife has a good job. we're happy here, the grass isn't always greener!

Morph, Building regs 2000 were revoked Oct '10 - how up to date are you ?

I'm pleased to hear it & wish you well.

I was in business for some 27 years, but I wouldn't like to start it again here & now.