Working for free while at college...

[OllieNotts]

Hi all, after a bit of advice regarding work experience. I have been offered the chance to shadow a guy and his lads on some domestic and commercial stuff.
What tools should I take if any? He didn't say much about what I would do other then working alongside his lads and learning from them. Not sure if I should turn up with a bag of tools(I don't have a proper one yet just the college crap I got conned in to buying) so should I get some?
Please don't have a go about working for free either, the guy has offered me a chance to learn and in the current climate a day a week "work experience" could get me on somewhere else or even on to agency work. Booked my CSCS card test today for 2 weeks time so hopefully might start being able to get some contacts in the trade and a bit of paid work while I learn.

 

[londonlec]

Sounds good I hope it gives you a chance to prove yourself and get some paid work off the guy.

I'd ring the employer/just take tools anyway I think.

 

[lfcsparkycus]

well done m8 on getting chance for some experience, ive read a few of your posts and im in the same boat as you(also looking for work) and have family. if working for peanuts or for free is good for you & family do it. certain people dont like it but they aint gotta pay your bills!

 

[telectrix]

as for tools, just the basics, screwdrivers, cutters, pliers, maybe a hammer and bolster chisel.

 

[OllieNotts]

well done m8 on getting chance for some experience, ive read a few of your posts and im in the same boat as you(also looking for work) and have family. if working for peanuts or for free is good for you & family do it. certain people dont like it but they aint gotta pay your bills!

Yeah well I am still working nights on agency but it is slow going at the minute, we are getting by....just. Thing is I am sat here twiddling my thumbs 2 days a week most weeks so figure I could be out learning something useful and with any luck this could lead in to something better pay wise at least. If the guy tries taking the pi55 that much I can always go home and he said there is no pressure to work with him if I am not happy it is totally my choice. Sounds as decent a bloke would who won't be paying me

 

[OllieNotts]

as for tools, just the basics, screwdrivers, cutters, pliers, maybe a hammer and bolster chisel.

Cheers, will do some online shopping tomorrow, any tips on where to buy?

 

[Gylesr]

good luck ollie! i started working voluntary for an electrician whilst at college to gain experience on-site and its given me great understanding and i can relate this to what im learning at college! if your willing to work people will notice and someone will give you that break! i was given a break by the guy i was with and will be starting with him in june! invest in a decent tool box as it will get chucked in and out of the van plus they take a beating on-site.
gyles

 

[OllieNotts]

Cheers, been advised to get a bag with a shoulder strap to start with cause they are cheap and I can carry on a bus instead of a tool box if I am going to be meeting them in notts city centre(they are there for 4-5 months still). I cant wait to see it all starting to make sense and as you say it might lead to a paid position I am not shy of working hard as long as they don;t try and take the pi55 too much

 

[Gylesr]

i dont think they will take the pi55!! just remember alot of them were in your position when they started! also keep asking questions if your unsure of anything! hope you enjoy it. just remember short term loses for long term gains!! as for tools

screwdriver set vde 1000v
snips
pliers long nose
stanley knife
mini hacksaw
hammer
cable cutters
adjustable grips/wrench
tape measure

these are just some of the basics!

 

[Knobhead]

Have sent you a PM

 

[mickys86]

Hi all, after a bit of advice regarding work experience. I have been offered the chance to shadow a guy and his lads on some domestic and commercial stuff.
What tools should I take if any? He didn't say much about what I would do other then working alongside his lads and learning from them. Not sure if I should turn up with a bag of tools(I don't have a proper one yet just the college crap I got conned in to buying) so should I get some?
Please don't have a go about working for free either, the guy has offered me a chance to learn and in the current climate a day a week "work experience" could get me on somewhere else or even on to agency work. Booked my CSCS card test today for 2 weeks time so hopefully might start being able to get some contacts in the trade and a bit of paid work while I learn.

I started work for free one day a week and after a few weeks the guy was impressed that I wasn't there to just stand and watch, I was getting involved and doing actual work so he paid me £40 for going. I put that £40 aside, saved it up and bought tools with it. Now I'm working full time for the same company whilst I complete my course. Best thing I've ever done

 

[OllieNotts]

Looking at these two kits,
Electricians Starter Bundle BARGAIN from The Crimp Company

595003 CK Tools Electricians Premium Kit in a CK Tool Bag from The Crimp Company

Gonna stick one of them on the credit card, don't want to spend any more then that. But looking the the one that is £185 is it worth the extra money? I did a quick check on everything in the kit and it comes to about £250 cant be bothered to do it for the other one
Is it value for money is what I am saying.

 

[Knobhead]

The bigger kit looks OK. But just bear in mind most of it won’t be top-flight gear.

Rule 1. it’s your kit, not free issue for every muppet on site!

 

[alarm man]

i dont think they will take the pi55!! just remember alot of them were in your position when they started!

i doubt it,most have been paid to train,never work for free it does no one any good,in fact its what employers want,how can you expect a decent wage when you have previously worked for free,its slave labour..you dont get anymore respect by working for free,you say the guy wont take the p,he already is..

 

[piratebillybob]

site experience is almost essential when trying to get an apprenticeship

when i was looking for mine i had no site experience but all distinctions for my exams. They werent too fussed about my distinctions, all they wanted to know was how capable i was onsite.

not too sure ild want to be in your place if you have an accident and youre not insured though.

yes that guy is taking advantage of you working for free. but if it means you getting an apprenticeship or a better job with someone else because youve got site experience then itll be worth it

apprenticeships are few and far between. you have to grab any advantage you can get over the next guy

 

[i=p/u]

i would work the first day for free and thats it , but only you can learn from it..

when i started i couldnt get out with anyone, started meeting people in belfast for work which i had to get train as is 70 miles away and one dude took the ****, didnt even tell me how much i was getting payed wouldnt awnser my phonecalls, i worked four days for free plus paid transport, not intentionally

agree money before you start in future, but if you want to try this i say why not if its not too much hassel to get too...

if they are decent they will agree money and chat you through the job..... even if 2 mins rundown.. good luck hope works out

 

[piratebillybob]

forgot to mention i did two weeks with two different companies for free.

there are companies out there who will string you along with the old "come do a work trial and well see how well you get on" and they have no interest in taking you on, they just want the free labour.

when i started i had the same outlook as you in that "i dont care if they dont pay me ill use them for experience" but after a few weeks youll start to resent the fact that they dont pay you even a token rate of a few quid an hour.

but in the end not getting a job at those two companies was the best thing because i ended up getting a fantastic opportunity with a national company

working for free is a very bitter pill to swallow. and there are many companies out there who will happily take advantage of that.

 

[mickys86]

First day for free?? It's hard enough getting started as it is. One day a week just to come along and learn isn't going to be takin the mickey. You aren't committed either so you can just stop if you ever feel that you want to

 

[Knobhead]

The unfortunate thing is we’re condemning a company that could be on the up and up.

Ollie give the company a time span you’re prepared to work for gratis, after that you want paying. And make sure it’s on a rising scale as you gain experience and become more a member of the team.

 

[mickys86]

The unfortunate thing is we’re condemning a company that could be on the up and up.

Ollie give the company a time span you’re prepared to work for gratis, after that you want paying. And make sure it’s on a rising scale as you gain experience and become more a member of the team.

Well said that man!

 

[Gylesr]

i doubt it,most have been paid to train,never work for free it does no one any good,in fact its what employers want,how can you expect a decent wage when you have previously worked for free,its slave labour..you dont get anymore respect by working for free,you say the guy wont take the p,he already is..

(never work for free it does no one any good)
what a stupid statement! its done me fine.. after working one day a week whilst at college the rest ive been given a apprenticship with the company i was working for free with! if i had gone there with no experience and asked for them to give me there time and be paid what do you think would be there response? they wudnt know anything about me or my skill level.
obviously dont work for a company for weeks on end for nothing for them to turn around and say no chance of a position that is slave labour! and personally i would give a young lad alot of respect for getting of his arse and offering to work for free to gain experience! in this current climate there arnt apprenticeships just floating around!

 

[Guest111]

Ollie tip for you taught it to my last apprentice,buy a roll of tape any colour will do, and put a small band of it around the handle of all tools pliers screwdrivers etc,then if anything goes missing you can spot it a mile off if it accidentally ends up in someone else,s kit good luck mate

 

[Mark_Burgess]

Ollie, Don't go buying a load of tools just yet.
As post no.2 says, give him a call and ask if he expects you to be tooled up or to literally give the others a hand in which case you won't need to take your own just yet.
I know you need tools at some point but remember, at this stage you are there to shadow/learn/help out, it is already going to cost you bus/train fair etc. If you put £185 on your card for a tool kit, do not do so until you can pay for it by using them for work. If the guy says after a few days work he will pay you, then fine go ahead buy what you need.
Make sure you have some steel toe capped footwear, get a cheap HI Vis vest for a couple of quid from a market or tesco etc so you have the basics.
Like others have said show enthusiasm and you my get taken on or recommended on to another company.
Leave your mobile phone on silent, forget you have the thing, even though you are not paid, show professionalism.
At least you have made a start, and let us know how it goes!!

 

[Guest111]

Yes good point Mark about mobiles had to tell my lad off a few times about that,he made a good apprentice and ended up getting a good job but if someone asked me his biggest fault when he came to me I would have to say it was his phone,may seem petty but as you say its about being professional and texting all day isn,t.

 

[piratebillybob]

my company sacked the last apprentice. Everytime anyone mentions him the first thing they say is "he was always on the phone"

but you will be tempted to look at it because there will be times when youre just stood there like a plum watching the electrician doing something tedious like make an swa gland off etc

But my best advice to anyone is to leave it at home or only look at it during break. If you look at it when youre supposed to be working youll get a crap reputation

as for tools i wouldnt go crazy either. The electricians youll be working with will have most of the tools needed. And your college ones will probably be adequate for the job too.

I only say go careful because worst case scenario is that you go out and buy hundreds of quids worth of tools and this electrician thing doesnt work out.

I know this sounds pessimistic but i know someone who got a £750 tester fresh out of college and it took him 18 months to find an apprenticeship. It was touch and go whether or not he had wasted a grand by splashing out on tools before getting a job.

 

[OllieNotts]

Thanks for the words of wisdom guys, hopefully it works out.

 

[mickys86]

(never work for free it does no one any good)
what a stupid statement! its done me fine.. after working one day a week whilst at college the rest ive been given a apprenticship with the company i was working for free with! if i had gone there with no experience and asked for them to give me there time and be paid what do you think would be there response? they wudnt know anything about me or my skill level.
obviously dont work for a company for weeks on end for nothing for them to turn around and say no chance of a position that is slave labour! and personally i would give a young lad alot of respect for getting of his arse and offering to work for free to gain experience! in this current climate there arnt apprenticeships just floating around!

That's exactly how I managed to get my apprenticeship

Good luck ollie hope it works out for ya!

 

[alarm man]

That's exactly how I managed to get my apprenticeship

Good luck ollie hope it works out for ya!

thats why this industry is on its knees,when sparks are looking to get a decent rate with their employers they say why should you get it when joe bloggs is working for free..we'll meet you half way,how does a bowl of rice sound..

 

[mickys86]

thats why this industry is on its knees,when sparks are looking to get a decent rate with their employers they say why should you get it when joe bloggs is working for free..we'll meet you half way,how does a bowl of rice sound..

The industry is on its knees because I went to work one day a week to gain experience???? I knew nothing, couldn't do anything on my own. I worked a few times when the person I was LEARNING from offered to pay me apprenticeship rates because he was impressed by the way I wanted to learn. And now I have a full apprenticeship with said company. I am learning all things commercial and domestic. If what I did is bringing the industry to its knees maybe I should have gone on a 5 week course and started my own company straight away

 

[alarm man]

aye very good..

 

[i=p/u]

you should always be doing something even if not out with sparks, its plan b, c and d that how i payed or my tools and ive probably a spare tool kit for my first apprentice

 

[jamie s]

i have done nearly 2 years of weekend work and only been paid small amounts of cash and in tools which was better than cash. finally reaping the rewards as starting to do private work and most new private work comes from recommendations which is positive as people must be happy. i can 100% say that working for free (or not much) gives you the belief, skills and competence needed when trying to train/retrain as an electrician

 

[ezzzekiel]

thats why this industry is on its knees,when sparks are looking to get a decent rate with their employers they say why should you get it when joe bloggs is working for free..we'll meet you half way,how does a bowl of rice sound..

so someone with no work experience are taking fully qualified electricians work because theyll work for free - very very weak argument.

If you are happy with the offer then learn from it and when you feel youve gained what you can ask for a wage or move on, not everyone is blessed with a full apprenticship and if this is what it takes for you to succeed then good luck with it.

 

[GLENNSPARK]

as has been said here already....give it a timespan...then ask to start getting paid.....otherwise this guy wont respect you....he`l just see you as free labour and wont be interested in teaching you owt either......to him you`l just be a cable puller...or something like that....so give it a timespan...then ask to get paid properly..on the books n all that...if he`s got anything about him at all he will realise that you`v shown a committed interest in his outfit....and should act accordingly......

 

[piratebillybob]

in an ideal world nobody would work for free.

But when youve got a class of 20+ 2nd year electrical students and a class of 20+ 3rd year students all wanting an apprenticeship then its dog eat dog.

And those who are bright enough to start working for free at the start of their 2nd year will be rewarded by being ahead of everyone at the end of it.

And if the other students are foolish enough to demand big wages, too proud to not work for free or not ambitious enough to study really hard to ensure you get all distinctions then thats even better for you.

Do what you have to do to get that job. Forget pride, forget being upset at the rejections youll face. Keep ringing round, keep pestering.

Because the job market for apprentices is absolutely brutal. I know because im only 6 months into mine and i dont envy anyone trying to get one at all

 

[OllieNotts]

I have had another email today asking to meet some one for a chat in a few weeks. So I can go this week for a gander and then possibly have a crack at another firm and if neither work out people can't say I haven't tried.
I am going to treat it as work experience, 5 free days over 5 weeks just like when I was at school and I did a week(5 days) for free then. Seems fair enough, didn't plunge for tools in the end as has been said I should wait until I start being paid so I will go keen and willing and if they want me to try my hand at anything I am sure they will be watching over me anyway can't see em letting me loose In which case they shouldn't have a problem with me using their gear.

 

[GLENNSPARK]

the main thing they will be looking for ollie....will be punctuality (timekeeping) and whether you will 'get stuck in'...show an interest....also stuff like how you act and behave in other peoples property and this would include due care around peoples posessions.....they arn't going to be too concerned about you sparkying skills...yet.......it will be a 'getting to know you' period......

 

[OllieNotts]

Aye, I have done a bit of work "on site" me self for a different kind of work installing heavy equipment and had all the rollockings one needs to understand how one behaves and conducts oneself in this situation. Great advice though all the same, hopefully this thread might help others in the same boat as me to.
Will update how it goes anyway, although if it is that bad I may never come back again

 

[GLENNSPARK]

Aye, I have done a bit of work "on site" me self for a different kind of work installing heavy equipment and had all the rollockings one needs to understand how one behaves and conducts oneself in this situation. Great advice though all the same, hopefully this thread might help others in the same boat as me to.
Will update how it goes anyway, although if it is that bad I may never come back again

yes do ollie....i am sure we all would like to know how you get on mate:yes:

 

[i=p/u]

i it aint easy, i sat about many days going why have i got into this but didnt want to start applying for other jobs again, you gotta be patient and hold tight and build build build on yourself, look at me im massive with electrics now, 3 years ago couldnt wire a pplug..

tell him glenspark,

 

[i=p/u]

good money in cleaning windows if you can get set of ladders bucket and wipes , keep ya fit too for all them atics

 

[alarm man]

good money in cleaning windows if you can get set of ladders bucket and wipes

ive heard it does make the job easier..:coolgleamA:

 

[GLENNSPARK]

i=p/u's right here ollie......you build on what your given......someone has given you an inlet....up to you now to kick the door open.....

 

[OllieNotts]

good money in cleaning windows if you can get set of ladders bucket and wipes , keep ya fit too for all them atics

Funny you should say that as last few years it has been quite difficult trying to get one now I have seen 3 different ones doing my road in the last month
I am not one for heights, or repeatedly trying to get the money off the customers who will never have the money ready. Be as bad if not worse then trying to get the money off your customers as a spark!