Sockets in bathrooms

[wheeto]

A friend of mine has installed a BS-1363 socket in their bathroom, well outside of the zones (but not 3m outside) and protected by a type A RCBO which is itself downstream of a type AC RCD. The friend installed the socket in a 40mm back box, and when (s)he moves house and gets an EICR, the socket will be replaced by a BS-4573 shaver socket.

This got me thinking: do we think 7671 will ever permit 1363 sockets in "Locations containing a bath or shower"?

 

[buzzlightyear]

Sockets are not allowed in bathrooms or shower rooms (apart from shaver-supply units) unless they can be fitted at least three metres from the bath or shower.

 

[wheeto]

In this room, the current regulations prohibit socket outlets unless they're at least 3m away from the bath and the shower. I wondered what members thought of the future, though?

 

[pc1966]

I think the issue is not just "Can water / wet hands touch the socket?" as much as "What will a future moron will bring in, plug in, and perch on the bath side?"

Of course an RCD ought to cover most of that risk, but RCD are not infallible and a good wet connection could result in a very high current before the RCD disconnects in tens of milliseconds.

 

[Lister1987]

I think the issue is not just "Can water / wet hands touch the socket?" as much as "What will a future moron will bring in, plug in, and perch on the bath side?"

Of course an RCD ought to cover most of that risk, but RCD are not infallible and a good wet connection could result in a very high current before the RCD disconnects in tens of milliseconds.

Maybe the regs will update and stipulate IP69 RCD sockets being allowed? Covers the RCD side and the water ingress issue

 

[wheeto]

Maybe the regs will update and stipulate IP69 RCD sockets being allowed? Covers the RCD side and the water ingress issue

Interesting thought, although I don't imagine that water ingress into the fitting is really the issue.

 

[snowhead]

There's no reason /need it should ever be changed.

Unless the London Fire Brigade produce evidence to prove not having sockets within 3mtrs is a danger.

 

[Lister1987]

Interesting thought, although I don't imagine that water ingress into the fitting is really the issue.

Neither do I but it would tick the boxes, was more for the RCD protection than anything so if you did get someone with a distain for life and wants to bathe with Talkie Toaster, you have the additional RCD protection
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There's no reason /need it should ever be changed.

Unless the London Fire Brigade produce evidence to prove not having sockets within 3mtrs is a danger.

Why LFB? or just LFAs in general?

 

[wheeto]

Why LFB? or just LFAs in general?

LFB may have a history of questionable stats having undue influence on the British Standards. Or may not; who knows?

 

[nicebutdim]

From a layman's perspective, I'd be inclined to view this in terms of benefits weighed against potential risks.


My parent's house used to have a 5A socket fitted to the bathroom ceiling, close to the door. They used to plug a night light into it and no one ever came to any harm, but that socket recently disappeared along with the perished VIR cable that brought power to it.

 

[westward10]

I have a socket outlet within 1m of my bath tub, it just happens to be on the landing.

 

[andyb]

A friend of mine has installed a BS-1363 socket in their bathroom, well outside of the zones (but not 3m outside) and protected by a type A RCBO which is itself downstream of a type AC RCD. The friend installed the socket in a 40mm back box, and when (s)he moves house and gets an EICR, the socket will be replaced by a BS-4573 shaver socket.

This got me thinking: do we think 7671 will ever permit 1363 sockets in "Locations containing a bath or shower"?

It already does allow sockets in bathrooms, and not 3m from zones but 3m from zone 1. So, it can't be within 2.4m of the bath or shower.
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I have a socket outlet within 1m of my bath tub, it just happens to be on the landing.

You have a bath on the landing?

 

[snowhead]

Why LFB? or just LFAs in general?

It was the LFB that raised the "big issue" of Plastic C.U. catching fire, overlooking the fact it was bad installation by poorly qualified and inexperienced persons, not bad product.

 

[davesparks]

I don't understand what you would want a 1363 socket in a bathroom for?

 

[Julie.]

I don't understand what you would want a 1363 socket in a bathroom for?

With my sensible head on - realistically it would appear ok for things like phone chargers/radio/tech and so on as some people will relax in a bath with media playing or gaming I guess.

Beyond that, I don't think anything should be connectable within the 3m range.

A rcd will be of little use, as soaking wet, even a few mA will be able to pass direct through the heart; whilst when dry (ish) the actual current through the vital organs would be reduced and the operating time does allow reasonable protection.

So I don't think there should ever be allowed the use of any 230V outlets within the 3m

However, I do think a new type outlet should be designed and approved for within this zone, and that would effectively be a USB port - having similar isolation as the shaver outlets

So people won't be inclined to run extension leads for phone/tech chargers into the zone!