Worrying activities!

stevels4 · Nov 17, 2017

I had a call out today as the customer reported they had no E7 since their electrician replaced the DB.
Looking at the meter I questioned if they ever had E7 as the meter was a single rate 4 wire.
"We did have storage heaters but had them took out so the electrician removed the E7 DB, the associated wiring and the timer clock.
Well that would explain the loss of the E7 then!
Electrician has obviously removed the cut out fuse to do this work and replace the DB with a split load one as no isloator was fitted and the seals were missing..but not authorised to do so no doubt!
Also obviously replaced the load meter tails to the DB as these were new and again seals missing, in fact one of the meter terminal covers screws was missing...again another no no!
The customer also mentioned the same electrician had disconnected the existing TT arrangement and connected the earth to the neutral on a TNCS but the cut out was not labelled as PME....another no no!
Not particularly happy at this point so checked the NIC paperwork for the installation to see a ZE of 0.13ohms recorded so assume correct and within specification.
The cables into the new DB had mostly been extended to reach, I assume they were all tightly and safely crimped before being wrapped in grey insulation tape not heatshrink.
So apart from unauthorised removal of the cut out fuse, unauthorised opening of a whole current meter,theft of a metering time-switch and decidedly dodgy wiring methods it was a great job.
Apologies for the picture quality.

Octopus · Nov 17, 2017

You need to instruct the customer to get the other spark back ........... and don't get involved.

Edit : removal of the DNO fuse is required for safe isolation.

stevels4 · Nov 17, 2017

I did exactly that, the customer's wiring and earthing arrangements are solely their responsibility beyond the cut out. It may have been best practice to have had an islolator fitted by a competent person before starting the work.

Octopus · Nov 17, 2017

stevels4 said:
I did exactly that, the customer's wiring and earthing arrangements are solely their responsibility beyond the cut out. It may have been best practice to have had an islolator fitted by a competent person before starting the work.

Why?

Deleted member 26818 · Nov 17, 2017

Lol, how much do you charge to tell the customer why they no longer have E7?

Des 56 · Nov 17, 2017

I cant make out much with that picture,it is one blurry critter

From what I can see,it looks like a bush has been planted nearby and is growing into the consumer unit
Are there flowers above the breakers ?

HappyHippyDad · Nov 17, 2017

Steve, could I ask how many consumer units you've changed? Do you contact the DNO every time to come and pull out the cut out fuse before you change the board?
You never know he may have actually contacted the DNO and used reg 537.1.3 and removed the fuse whilst meeting the regulations.
As for the crimping, I would usually use heatshrink but I can't think of a reg it's breaking to use insulation tape?
He's upgraded the tails to 25mm which is a good thing. Maybe he's contacted the service provider about the missing screw in the meter?
Why don't you give him a ring and have a chat if your concerned, you can ask him directly and get some facts.
Good luck

jackhammerJIM · Nov 17, 2017

The only thing i make out from the picture is its a chint db

WillWX · Nov 17, 2017

I don't get this thread one bit..

sparkdog · Nov 17, 2017

Getting the DNO to remove the fuse is a bit like dialling 999 if someone runs over a hedgehog.

westward10 · Nov 17, 2017

If they have lost their E7 why not call back the original culprit instead of the OP.

stevels4 · Nov 17, 2017

happyhippydad said:
Steve, could I ask how many consumer units you've changed? Do you contact the DNO every time to come and pull out the cut out fuse before you change the board?
You never know he may have actually contacted the DNO and used reg 537.1.3 and removed the fuse whilst meeting the regulations.
As for the crimping, I would usually use heatshrink but I can't think of a reg it's breaking to use insulation tape?
He's upgraded the tails to 25mm which is a good thing. Maybe he's contacted the service provider about the missing screw in the meter?
Why don't you give him a ring and have a chat if your concerned, you can ask him directly and get some facts.
Good luck

In the 20 years I worked contract I have lost count of the number of CUs I have replaced after cut out fires have damaged installations.
I don't need to contact the DNO to remove a cut out fuse as I am authorised to do so.
Please check the notes applied to 537.1.3 regarding authorisation from the DNO, this is not something you can get over the phone.
The use of insulation tape....agreed perfectly safe, updated cable, meets the required regs just looks messy.
Nothing on my job notes but missing screw no longer a problem after meter was replaced.
No need to take it any further, I did what was required to get the customer back onto an E7 supply and re-sealed.

stevels4 · Nov 17, 2017

Murdoch said:
Why?

Because it would have provided a safe means of isolation and being installed on the meter load tails would meet the requirements of BS7671.

davesparks · Nov 18, 2017

happyhippydad said:
As for the crimping, I would usually use heatshrink but I can't think of a reg it's breaking to use insulation tape?

Apart from the blindingly obvious problem with using tape there are regulations to cover this, and to fully comply you would need to be very careful over the choice of exactly which specification of heatshrink is used.

Deleted member 9648 · Nov 18, 2017

Sorry if I'm missing something but are those stringy bits below the DB the crimped cables? If so are the crimps exposed to touch?

HappyHippyDad · Nov 18, 2017

davesparks said:
Apart from the blindingly obvious problem with using tape there are regulations to cover this, and to fully comply you would need to be very careful over the choice of exactly which specification of heatshrink is used.

Can you expand a bit please Dave? Is it because the insulation tape is not thick enough to offer basic insulation? Also with regard the heatsink are you talking about the different types of heatshrink? Thick glue lined as opposed to thin not glued?

westward10 · Nov 18, 2017

Why put anything on an insulated crimp.

stevels4 · Nov 18, 2017

Hopefully a slightly improved picture.

stevels4 · Nov 18, 2017

No it's not! Trying to bluetooth from one device to my ipad but not working.

davesparks · Nov 18, 2017

happyhippydad said:
Can you expand a bit please Dave? Is it because the insulation tape is not thick enough to offer basic insulation? Also with regard the heatsink are you talking about the different types of heatshrink? Thick glue lined as opposed to thin not glued?

No it’s because the glue goes off and the tape loosens, becomes a sticky mess and falls off after a few years, you must have come across this on installations?

I mean the choice of heatshrink with regards having the correct voltage rating and mechanical properties as needed, also it may need to meet standards for flammability or lsf insulation etc. Each application is going to be different and may need different materials.

davesparks · Nov 18, 2017

happyhippydad said:
Can you expand a bit please Dave? Is it because the insulation tape is not thick enough to offer basic insulation? Also with regard the heatsink are you talking about the different types of heatshrink? Thick glue lined as opposed to thin not glued?

No it’s because the glue goes off and the tape loosens, becomes a sticky mess and falls off after a few years, you must have come across this on installations?

I mean the choice of heatshrink with regards having the correct voltage rating and mechanical properties as needed, also it may need to meet standards for flammability or lsf insulation etc. Each application is going to be different and may need different materials.