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I’m a trainee electrician and would really appreciate the benefit of someone’s skill and experience on the following:

Our house is a TN-C-S (100A fuse) with a main DB (100mA RCD).

This DB feeds a sub DB in a garage outbuilding via a 6mm SWA with all 3 conductors used, by a 63A MCB. The armour is also earthed for mechanical protection.

The sub DB (30mA RCD) is also a TT system with 10mm earth cable to electrode. (I’ve tested the electrode and it’s at 83 Ohms so well inside the 200 Ohms limit.

The sub board feeds the following in garage and outside:

Outside

32A hot tub via 6mm SWA

16A power radial

6A lighting

Inside garage:
32A ring

6A lighting

I’ve checked all cable runs for voltage drop and current capacity, all fall within BS7671.

The issues I’m unsure of is:

1.The sub DB is taking the PME from main DB, whilst also benefiting from an earth electrode. AFAIK having 2 x systems of earthing may conflict and lead to main DB RCD tripping, and not the sub board, but I could be wrong?

2.The 6mm SWA has a current capacity of 53A (ref method D), with a 32A hot tub and diversity applied to both power and lighting I’m coming in at 36.92A + 32A = 68.92A. In reality the ring circuit in garage is rarely used above a freezer and occasional drill etc. Certainly nothing with a load that would require a ring final circuit for a new instal.

My initial thoughts were to change the ring final to a radial, with diversity applied will be 13A therefore bringing the total to 60.9A but this is still too much. The next choice would be to upgrade the feed SWA to 10mm giving me 71A.

What’s your options on this? And the best way to make things compliment, both for SWA size and earthing issue?

Thanks in advance.
 
I'd like to know this too - wonder if anyone has collated such events via FOI request or similar. Since it is regularly raised as a potential risk in guides etc, I'd like to know just how often it happens so that I can make a well informed risk assessment on certain types of job.
Available data getting a bit old now....
[ElectriciansForums.net] Assistance with my installation



Interestingly someone tried an FOI request in Nov 2021 and HSE never responded, leading to the ICO upholding a complaint.
I can't find the results though.
 
I looked at a few of these posts then skipped to the end. Take no notice of the majority of these as they just seem as though they like to argue rather than knowing what there doing. Exporting a TNCS is fine as long as you can prove and are happy it's OK. A 100mA RCD can trip before the 30mA at x5, it shouldn't but it can. To stop this you can install a separate isolator at the mains so it doesn't come from the board in the house then run the SWA to the shed from that. Your running a sub main not a finale circuit so it does not need protecting by an RCD. If you still want the shed to be TT then terminate the SWA into a plastic adaptable box then run the correct sized earth from the stake to the shed DB.
 
default said : " Take no notice of the majority of these as they just seem as though they like to argue rather than knowing what there doing. "

But do you know what you're doing? Because I think what you're suggesting wouldn't be compliant.
 
Last edited:
@default has the right kind of idea but the wording is a little suspect. Let me adjust it a bit:
To stop this you can install a separate isolator split the tails and used a suitably sized switched fuse at the mains so it doesn't come from the board in the house then run the SWA to the shed from that. Your running a sub main not a finale circuit As the SWA cable has an earthed metal covering it does not need protecting by an RCD for Impact Protection purposes, though may for fault protection.
 
I looked at a few of these posts then skipped to the end. Take no notice of the majority of these as they just seem as though they like to argue rather than knowing what there doing.
It's well worth having a read through of this thread in its entirety, there's some useful information here
 
The post in the beginning was referring to A TNcs in the main property, but TT to the outer building asking what should be.
Exporting a TNcs is fine has long has their is no extraneous metel work in the outer building and if so then a either bond back or TT it
You can still export a TNCS to a shed if there is metal work in it. This shed is not a special location.
 
Explain why you think this.
Tim at post #33

Exporting a PME earth isn't as simple as you suggest, as there will be a number of factors that have to be taken into account, depending on its use.
You wouldn't want to be running a 16mm 3 core swa to a customers wooden potting shed that is 2mtrs away, has no extraneous earths and has just one lighting point.

On the other hand, you wouldn't want to export to a cattle shed.




 
Last edited:
Pretty mouth at Post #34

Exporting a PME earth isn't as simple as you suggest, as there will be a number of factors that have to be taken into account, depending on its use.
You wouldn't want to be running a 16mm 3 core swa to a customers wooden potting shed that is 2mtrs away, has no extraneous earths and has just one lighting point.


The original post said nothing about specific factors. So unless it's a metal container, swimming pool, caravan or some other type of special location there are no regs saying it can not be exported.
 
It has already been mentioned on here that you are not 'EXPORTING' TN-C-S you are utilising a cpc derived from a TN-C-S earthing system.
 
Another misworded publication. The schemes actively promote the term 'exporting'.
 
Tim at post #33

Exporting a PME earth isn't as simple as you suggest, as there will be a number of factors that have to be taken into account, depending on its use.
You wouldn't want to be running a 16mm 3 core swa to a customers wooden potting shed that is 2mtrs away, has no extraneous earths and has just one lighting point.

On the other hand, you wouldn't want to export to a cattle shed.




Not saying you would, but you could.
 
Maybe but to export it you would have to do exactly that. The fact that you could have a 'special location' downstream in some cases may not be relevant. I could have a bathroom in this downstream location but could still employ the TN-C-S derived earth.
 
Maybe but to export it you would have to do exactly that. The fact that you could have a 'special location' downstream in some cases may not be relevant. I could have a bathroom in this downstream location but could still employ the TN-C-S derived earth.
Having a bathroom on a TNCS is fine as long as you keep to the regs but there are some special locations where a TNCS can not be used.
 

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