12v lighting in a bathroom

[Tiger]

It's my understanding that 12v circuit is fine, i will check. Now your argument for it being an existing circuit doesnt work for me as it's a special location and if you are touching any special location you must upgrade it to the latest regs. I hate the grey areas, ive even had 2 different answers on things from 2 different people at the Nic before

The OSG does not specify circuit voltage.

Quote:

"all the circuits of the location must be protected by 30mA RCD's."

I'am sure i have read a seperate thing somewhere specifying selv are ok. Will have to find it

 

[jeremy]

The circuit (230) isn't in the bathroom, it's in the ceiling. The circuit (12) in the bathroom is not connected to the "mains" and is SEPERATE extra low voltage designed for its lack of danger

 

[Spudnik]

I agree Tiger, so at the end of the day, as this needs notifying i would just do it.

Could easily be done with an RCD spur that covers bathroom lighting only.

Fair enough jeremy, but i think ill stick to the regs

in particular: 701.411.3.3

 

[jeremy]

Sorry fella, page11 1.1.ii at a nominal voltage of 230V single phase etc. I take no joy in that

 

[WarrenG]

Heres a link to the NICEIC Bathroom guide:

http://www.willetttechnicalservices.co.uk/bathroomzones.pdf

 

[jeremy]

Maybe i should read these regs fully! Sorry guys , not trying to be a pain but like to understand why, not just do because I'm told to!

 

[Spudnik]

Maybe i should read these regs fully! Sorry guys , not trying to be a pain but like to understand why, not just do because I'm told to!

There are LOADS of regs in the BRB that most of us would love to know why.

Unfortunately, the book is not designed to explain why,
Its just to tell us how to comply.

I didnt know i was a poet

 

[lister]

biggest problem with the regs is how different people interpret them if they were written in plain english it might help


all these new regs seem fine for new installs or refits but for upgrades seems to me like a lot of work just to change the light fittings, i dont like the rcd in loft idea, customers playing hunt the reset button- not great, and anyway seems to be out side of the 450 - 1200mm mounting height.

heres my interpretation

Q- how many circuits has house got
A- count no of mcb's in cu

so surley after fiting spots mcb quantity is the same, so no new curcuit there then. so only minor works and part p reg needed, not rcd.

 

[WarrenG]

You would think using the same lighting feed to the bathroom, it would just be that, but it is a special location.

Thats how I interpret it anyway?

 

[Spudnik]

Chaps,

ANY circuit in a bathroom or special location now requires RCD protection. If the install is reasonably new then its possible that there may be a spare way in the DB on the RCD side so the MCB which has the bathroom on would just need swapping over.

If the install seems dated then, without huge cost to the customer, an RCD spur, not neccessarily fitted in the loft (airing cupboard) can be installed to protect the bathroom lighting only.

IF a pull switch, shaver socket, ceiling light is being replaced like for like then no need.

At the end of the day, its your name on the cert, which will be needed, and also this work would need notifying, therefore it will be fully traceable right back to your front door if an injury ever occurred and you failed to comply.

 

[ian hall]

I,ve had 2 more bathroom jobs in the last 2 days. Low voltage ceiling light and one of those light/fan units where the light is 12v and the fan is up in the roof. Why is an rcd needed on either of these. Has anyone had an opinion from the Niceic on this?


Ian

 

[professional]

Why on earth would you want an opinion from the NICEIC? You should be working to BS7671 - these have nothing to do with any Scheme Operator. The regs require you to RCD any new or altered circuit in a bathroom - dispensation is not given for low voltage down-lighters. I find it somewhat concerning that many people who should have (by now) passed an exam on the 17th Ed of the regs seem to know very little about them - yet seem confident in their abilities to work unsupervised!

 

[ezzzekiel]

regs do require rcd protection to all circuits in special location, which is a bit of a dumber considering the 12V output of the transformer has no relationship to the earthed neutral of the supply so an RCD would not detect a fault on the circuit. but as already mentioned a rcd spur isnt a big extra effort (although there is also argument that the whole circ needs rcd not just the part youre working on)


there is always a difference in opinion on interpretation of the regs, and my view is as youre the electrician, as long as in the event of going in to see the judge you can explain how you carried out the works and how to the best of your view you have complied then i cant see a problem on how you achieve it.