230V fan in Zone 1?

[jstephens251]

Hi all,

1st fixing a barn conversion at the mo


Builder has threw a spanner in the works and says the location of fan will now be in zone 1 near shower.

If it has to be selv then i will wire for a transformer. only snag is i allowed for standard fan and selv fan is a *** load more lol

the OSG says though minimum IPX5 with water jets and i was looking at this unit

XPELAIR DX100BT 100MM AXIAL BATHROOM FAN WITH TIMER. Free delivery! | eBay

what you reckon?

 

[Plonker 3]

Well that''s down to interpretation, as it says IPX4 unless it is likely to come into contact with spray e.g cleaning. Now how many people up and down the country would not use the shower head to clean the tiles down? Not saying they will spray directly at the fan but near to it.

 

[Richard Burns]

The fan identified in the OP is listed as IPX5 and so is suitable for use in zone one and in an area with water jets.

The thing to remember about water jets is that they are meant to be powerful and the spray head of a standard shower is not considered a water jet.
IPX4 means it can cope with splashed water from any direction so theoretically playing a shower on an IPX4 item should be safe ( I wouldn't risk it).
If you start considering the mobile spray head as the location of the shower then most of a small bathroom would be zone 1! It is the fixed outlet that is of relevance to the regs.

 

[spark 68]

The one I had was not a fixed head shower, so I basically covered my ---

Edit: Yep regs clear as mud as ever

 

[Plonker 3]

I took my interpretation from 701.512.2 where it merely says that sprays for cleaning purposes needs IP X5, but I am happy to be corrected.

 

[spark 68]

As you say, it boils down to interpretation, and what you are comfortable signing your name to.

IPX4 protected from water splashing for all directions

IPX5 protected from low pressure jets from all directions

IPX6 protected from high pressure jets from all directions

It is up to whoever is signing the paperwork to decide what a shower is classed as, not to really prove anyone is right or wrong, we will all have our own take on it.

 

[Geoffsd]

Don't forget electric showers, they're 240V, IPX4 and in zone 1.

 

[Silly Sausage]

Yes, because if your intention is to detach it and then point and blast at a piece of electrical equipment then you deserve to be a in a body bag!

I wouldn't call children morons, something else maybe...



edit, wrong quote, but...

 

[Plonker 3]

Don't forget electric showers, they're 240V, IPX4 and in zone 1.

Maybe, but playing devils advocate they are covered by manufacturers instructions rather than BS7671. Just like if a fans instruction manual says it is suitable for zone 1 of a bathroom, regardless of the IP rating

 

[spark 68]

To be fair I am not really comfortable fitting 230V fans in zone 1, particularly if it can be sprayed with the shower (kids might find that funny and a great game), so I would prefer to fit Selv, or if it really had to be 230V then IPX5 (unless the manufacture stated a particular type @ IPX4 was suitable for zone 1).

This is just my interpretation of things, and my personal opinion, others may well decide differently, me ? I prefer to err on the side of caution.

 

[Richard Burns]

1 Protected against vertically falling drops of water (condensation)
2 Protected against drops of water falling at up to 15 deg from the vertical
3 Protected against drops of water falling at up to 60 deg from the vertical
4 Protected against splashing of water from all directions
5 Protected against jets of water from all directions (12.5 mm core nozzle, 10 m head at 3m distance)
6 Protected against jets of water from all directions (12.5 mm core nozzle, 10 m head at 1.3 m distance)

 

[spark 68]

This is the Nics version, it is basically the same as that in GN1.

That one of yours Rich looks a more comprehensive version.

 

[Engineer54]

This is the Nics version, it is basically the same as that in GN1.

That one of yours Rich looks a more comprehensive version.

Just had a look at that pdf. ...Now in all my data relating to IP codes, the 3rd figure always relates to impact resistance!! What that NICIC chart is giving, is basically already covered in the dust protection chart....

 

[spark 68]

That Nic chart is almost the same as the one given in GN1 E54,
Impact resistance is now given as IK codes (BS EN 62262:2002)

Here you go E54, http://en.hrlm.com/main/view.asp?id0=5&id1=5&id2=5&id=24

This has the IEC prefix

Edit: I also had a look at several different IP charts, and there is a bit of a variation between IPX4 and IPX5 descriptions depending whose chart you look at, I usually just use GN1, confusion abounds lol

 

[jstephens251]

To be fair I am not really comfortable fitting 230V fans in zone 1, particularly if it can be sprayed with the shower (kids might find that funny and a great game), so I would prefer to fit Selv, or if it really had to be 230V then IPX5 (unless the manufacture stated a particular type @ IPX4 was suitable for zone 1).

This is just my interpretation of things, and my personal opinion, others may well decide differently, me ? I prefer to err on the side of caution.

Thats exactly my thoughts on it.

Thats why I chose the IPX5 version shown in link

Was curious to peoples thoughts

 

[old_sparky_RE]

As D Skelton said earlier, the BGB 701.55 (viii) Ventilation equipment can be put in "Zone 1 according to the manufacture's instructions".
Devil's Advocate here... When I was growning up in the 70's the water pressure was very low and would take an age to fill the tub. I now live less than half a mile from where I grew up as a child and the water preasure in my home could strip the paint off a battle ship!
So, yes an IP X4 MAY be OK dependent on pressure and position of vent in respect to the shower head. But in my home you could argue that IP X6 would be needed because of the water pressure!

My take .... if the vent is above the shower head then IP X5. 2-3 feet away IP X4.
Like I said it's my take on it.