Priced to do kitchen electrics & mains board upgrade for someone a while back, they accepted my price. I explained that the mains needed changed as there was no RCD protection & prior to upgrade I’d carry out an EICR on the installation & if any C1 or C2 observations were made these would need to be rectified at an extra cost prior to upgrade. Now, a week before the kitchen went ahead I picked up an injury so had to take time off work. I got someone else to do the kitchen work for me but they had no time to the mains & testing. Now I’m back at work & they’re being funny about the mains board needing changed, saying they don’t want it done, since I have now done EICR & I have to upgrade main bond & get an earth to the external boiler. I obviously can’t force them to do it, yet it needs done & if it’s not done the electrical work carried out by the other electrician isn’t properly protected. What’s best to do here? Just issue the failed EICR?
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Vortigern
Arms
Why would you want to certify another electricians work? What I am puzzled about is what kind of spark does not certify the work he does, was the part of the arrangement that you would certify? And what about building control notice. Sounds like this could all get a bit complicated. Personally I would let the person who did the work sort it out.
So the new circuits are energised and the consumer unit wasn't changed?
Tricky. The problem is that the customer now see's working electrics and will have no comprehension of the safety features / requirements.
Are building control involved for any reason? If so, it's simple, no EIC as it's not up to scratch.
Did the other electrician work directly for them, or is the customer paying you and you paying them?
You might just have to cut your losses here, and cover yourself by putting in writing that the consumer unit upgrade and bonding upgrade is required to make the installation compliant and safe and without this happening you can't certify the work and obtain the building control paperwork they'll need to prove it was done properly if they ever sell the house. (We all know there are ways around this for them, but it's worth a try)
It's really not good if the other sparks energised new or modified circuits without at least testing them first.
Are building control involved for any reason? If so, it's simple, no EIC as it's not up to scratch.
Did the other electrician work directly for them, or is the customer paying you and you paying them?
You might just have to cut your losses here, and cover yourself by putting in writing that the consumer unit upgrade and bonding upgrade is required to make the installation compliant and safe and without this happening you can't certify the work and obtain the building control paperwork they'll need to prove it was done properly if they ever sell the house. (We all know there are ways around this for them, but it's worth a try)
It's really not good if the other sparks energised new or modified circuits without at least testing them first.
Yes I get that you’re not meant to energise without protection being up to scratch. The problem being the kitchen had to get ahead as the kitchen firm had it booked in that week, I’d hoped to be back the following week to swap the board over. There was no new circuits added, just a few extra sockets & switches. I’m sure everyone knows things aren’t always done in the order they should be, always a bit of come & go to get people up & running.
Sorry, forgot to reply to the other parts. Building control not involved no. I billed the customer for the other electricians work then paid him. I could swap the main switch for an RCD main switch as there’s only 4 circuits, this would keep the price down but I’m no keen to have the whole house on one RCD. This would at least give the circuits more protection. Could I possibly do this, then issue the EICR & note that the rest of the installation is unsafe due to the bonding problem?
Jobs like this are a pain where for what ever reason corners get cut and the job is left not properly finished.
If they have paid for the kitchen new wiring but now refusing the board change then Imo there isn't much more you can do other than walk away
If they have paid for the kitchen new wiring but now refusing the board change then Imo there isn't much more you can do other than walk away
I'd be arguing relentlessly with myself in these circumstances!
On the one hand conceding to any lesser job is sort of approving a lower standard.
On the other hand I'd struggle to sleep having had some indirect responsibility for adding sockets and there being no RCD.
(let alone no SPD, maybe plastic CU)
I'm also wondering if it's actually better/possible to add a compatible type A RCBO to the sockets circuit as maybe that was the only circuit modified(?), and that leaves the lights on if the sockets trip.
Horrible decisions!
D
davesparks
Yes we all sometimes have to do things we wouldn't normally do in order to get things working, keep the customer happy etc etc. But when we do something like that we have to understand that we are taking a risk and it may well come back to bite us.
This is when having a good paper trail behind you can help to keep you out of trouble.
Do you have a paper trail that proves you quoted for all necessary works, made it clear that it all needs to be done for a safe, compliant job, and proof that the customer agreed to the whole quote and has chosen to cancel the job part-way through?
D
davesparks
Has the customer paid for the EICR to be carried out or are they going to pay for it? If not don't issue it.
An EICR is not relevant to the installation work carried out, that needs to be certified with either a minor works or EIC.
If you have just altered 2 circuits and not worked on any others then it is only those 2 circuits that you strictly need to ensure compliance of, could this be done by installing 2 RCBO's or a seperate enclosure with 2 RCDs?
Is the installation any less safe than it was before the recent additional work,, No.
(presumably nothing stupid has been done to make it worse)
If the recent work had not been done would the installation be any safer,, No.
As long as you have written proof the customer is not prepared to pay for recommended work and the above statements are correct, you are covered.
Given the customer's response I doubt they would let you in to do any futher work, even if at no cost, for fear you may want to remove / disconnect the work that has been done.
(presumably nothing stupid has been done to make it worse)
If the recent work had not been done would the installation be any safer,, No.
As long as you have written proof the customer is not prepared to pay for recommended work and the above statements are correct, you are covered.
Given the customer's response I doubt they would let you in to do any futher work, even if at no cost, for fear you may want to remove / disconnect the work that has been done.
First of all thanks for your help, good to get different views. Panic over! They’ve decided they will go ahead & get the work done. They said they weren’t against getting the board replaced they just thought the extra work would involve running 10mm earth through lobby where there’s laminate flooring then in the extension where the new kitchen is they thought would also be getting patches cut etc. Fortunately we noticed the old 6mm that feeds the tank that is no longer in the attic is still in, so I’ll be able to tie onto this & pull right up into the attic over to a shaft that drops down into extension where stopcock is, then from there run the cable under the kick boards to the boiler pipe work where it enters the extension. Have to say, the husband still wasn’t keen to do it “we’ve not had any problems with not having it so far”. Luckily the wife was having none of it & wants it done.
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