Am I "Qualified" a electrician ?

[stokesie]

hi just looking for some advice.

I have c&g in:-
2360 part 1
2360 part 2
2377 pat testing.
3666 optical fibre.

The 2360 part 1 & 2 are 5 years apart.
The part 2 I have
assignments part 2 pass
Installation, commissioning,and fault diagnosis credit
Electrical, science and principles credit.
I believe I need a completion cert for full part 2.

What would be my next step?

 

[Engineer54]

Please anyone show me legislation that proves beyond doubt that anyone that starts a business TOMORROW as a ' Qualified Electrician' can be prosecuted for trading as as an 'Electrician' ? If this was the case the courts would be full...My Nan could start up tommorrow as an 'Electrician'...if she injured someone that's a different kettle of fish...Qualification in its self means nowt...Just look at the Electrical Trainee's ?
J

Wrong ...Qualifications are a MUST HAVE they are certified proof that you have successfully completed a specified course!! However, it really does need to be the right qualifications to make any sense holding them. A perfect example are those pointless qualifications that 17 day whizzer's and electrical trainee's hold. These would hold little to no meaning without a recognised base qualification!!

As for the rest of your post, ...You can thank all the parasitic organisations that have been left to get a strangle hold within the electrical industry. You are now nothing more than cheap labour and cash cows, to be passed around as they please by these leeches...

 

[Jimmy Boy]

Wrong ?..Then point me to legislation as I already have asked that says I have to have qualifications to carry out electrical work ? The only legislation I can find that would cover our work is EAWR, and I can find nothing in there that says you MUST have formal qualifications, would you get a job on the cards or on site without them ?..Probably not...but to trade as an electrician I don't believe you do..well register with a scam provider maybe..lol !

 

[shagbite]

legislation requires you to be 'competent' and, as we can see on another thread right now (scam questions), not everyone's in agreement as to how we should be able to prove 'competency'.


bs7671 has a paragraph on it though, and they think you should have qualifications.



edit: alright, i'm on my 8th can... i know they don't mention qual's specifically, but qualifications are a good indication for proving technical knowledge......did i say i was on my 8th can??

 

[Jimmy Boy]

legislation requires you to be 'competent' and, as we can see on another thread right now (scam questions), not everyone's in agreement as to how we should be able to prove 'competency'.


bs7671 has a paragraph on it though, and they think you should have qualifications.

I agree completely...Competent yes...but Qualified doesn't necessarily mean competent BS7671 isnt law EAWR is..as EAWR states....




Persons to be competent to prevent danger and injury
16. No person shall be engaged in any work activity where technical knowledge or experience is necessary to prevent danger or, where appropriate, injury, unless he possesses such knowledge or experience, or is under such degree of supervision as may be appropriate having regard to the nature of the work.

J

 

[Guest55]

my 2p jimmy ,

there is no law or requirement to be "qualified" in any way to carry out electrical work of any kind , so theres no point in looking for a definitive definition in what constitutes "qualified" , unlike in the medical and legal professions which have clear criteria.
instead the electrical indusrty relies on the wishy-washy term "competent" which can be considered a combination of experience , training and qualifications.
of course the full extent of your competency can only be measured / proved if you have the misfortune to be up in court cos things have got "bent".

so there it is.
;-)

 

[Jimmy Boy]

yep and wish washy...has landed us with Part P...no clarity...no nothing..
J

 

[skamuk]

Ok. Just to clarify.... I'm more than half way through 2365 L2 at the moment.

Now all I will need after that is:
* 2365 L3;
* 2357 NVQ (I believe this is the new 2356, and is available at my college);
* NET AM2 Assessment.

So after successfully completing all of the above, I can then register as a qualified electrician and carry out work?

Only problem I may have here is that the 2357 NVQ requires me to enrol as an apprentice, which is a problem because I work for my old man as a labourer and also carry out small electrical work such as disconnecting down-lights and reconnecting after plastering, changing transformers, installing new light switches ect. I can only assume this is not enough to qualify as an apprentice, and it's so hard to find anyone willing to take on apprentices!

 

[Johnuk]

Ok. Just to clarify.... I'm more than half way through 2365 L2 at the moment.

Now all I will need after that is:
* 2365 L3;
* 2357 NVQ (I believe this is the new 2356, and is available at my college);
* NET AM2 Assessment.

So after successfully completing all of the above, I can then register as a qualified electrician and carry out work?

Only problem I may have here is that the 2357 NVQ requires me to enrol as an apprentice, which is a problem because I work for my old man as a labourer and also carry out small electrical work such as disconnecting down-lights and reconnecting after plastering, changing transformers, installing new light switches ect. I can only assume this is not enough to qualify as an apprentice, and it's so hard to find anyone willing to take on apprentices!

it will make you a j.i.b gold card electrician yes and opens more doors than just a 1/Electrical Trainee person

 

[skamuk]

Cheers for your reply John. Nice to know I'm spending my time wisely by doing the right courses. It's hard to get a simple, straight answer out of my college! Is it true there is a 2365 L4 course or is that another college rumour out of all I've heard?

What's a 1/Electrical Trainee person?

Also Is is correct to do the AM2 as the last thing or can I do it after completing 2365 L3?

 

[markc123]

Electrical Trainee is a 5week wonder....these people are becoming competent electricians and are taking the mick out of people like you and me who are doing it / have done it the proper route - yes i realise you're not doing a proper apprentership, which i can understand are hard to come by these days - but you are doing the next best thing, and the qualifications you recieve from doing the full time course are pretty much the same as the apprentership without the infield experience - and for this, skamuk i salute you.

Was just wondering how you're going to be able to do your NVQ though without having an apprentership?

AM2 i think is the last course you take at college yes, your tutor will be able to tell you what dates you will be sitting it. You'll sit the AM2 whenever your college teacher thinks you're ready (i think, don't quote me on this)

After you've done the couses that you have listed, you should think about doing the 2394 and 2395 testing qualifications.

 

[Geordie Spark]

In my day the 2360 came in A), B), C). B and C i seem to remember came in as a single examination taken in two parts... Maybe someone here can verify that or not??
I would also state that the 2360 was superior to the 2330 that replaced it, but that's my opinion. lol!!


At least in those day's examinations were just that. No multiple choice questions then, all were set questions that you had to know and provide the calculations and/or descriptive answers to substantiate. I don't think i've ever sat an open book examination ever!! lol!! And another thing, in those early day's calculators were not allowed in the examination room either!!

You lot don't realise just how easy you have it these day's...lol!!

Aye .... because calculators hadn't been invented then. It was all done with an Abacus and slide rule.

 

[MDJ]

236 came in parts A ( 1st year ) , B ( 2nd year ) and C ( optional 1 year Technicians course)
2360 ( introduced around 1990 ) came in parts 1 , 2 & 3 (C) , which is the course i completed at tech.
written exams for each year were indeed in 2 parts , 4-5 hours in total from what i can barely remember lol

The 236 part 2 was over 2 years when I did it, part 1= 1 year, part 2= 2 years and AM2 at the end of it, then 12 months on site after to gain electricians status, Some of us had a go at the C certificate as well, and that was 2 years also, no idea whats what today. To clarify The 3 years for parts 1 and 2 at college was block Courses and several weeks at college then several weeks on site, too and frowing.

 

[SAILOR48]

No recognized trade as electrician.

 

[UNG]

In my day the 2360 came in A), B), C). B and C i seem to remember came in as a single examination taken in two parts... Maybe someone here can verify that or not??
I would also state that the 2360 was superior to the 2330 that replaced it, but that's my opinion. lol!!


At least in those day's examinations were just that. No multiple choice questions then, all were set questions that you had to know and provide the calculations and/or descriptive answers to substantiate. I don't think i've ever sat an open book examination ever!! lol!! And another thing, in those early day's calculators were not allowed in the examination room either!!

You lot don't realise just how easy you have it these day's...lol!!

When they first allowed calculators in the exam room you still had to show all the working out to get the full marks, I remember my first calculator cost me £50 a few years later I was given a more powerful one by a rep looking for business

i'd be hard pressed to argue with you e54. i did the 2330 and it was very easy. even so, when i was at college, i saw lads who were clearly out of their depth but, still managed to blag their way through the exams. personally, i'd do away with the multiple choice exams; when you dumb down to the levels that city and guilds have, it can only serve to harm the electrical industry.


i read somewhere that the 2360 was scrapped because it was too hard. then, i think they replaced it with the 2351(?) which wasn't well received by the industry. so, they tried again with the 2330 (apparently better than 2351 but not as good as 2360). now they're doing it again, with the 2391 - scrapping it because it's 'too hard'.
scrapping something because it's too hard doesn't make much sense to me, especially when you're dealing with electricity. the more cynical side of me tends to think it's more to do with money but any short term monetary gains they make, will be far outweighed by the long term negative effects that it has on the electrical industry. saturating the country with sub-standard, under trained electricians is a recipe for disaster.

Unfortunately it's not PC to tell someone they have failed these days so they dumb down the exams so the less able can meet the grade

I think the 2391 was killed off for a few reasons not least that computers can't easily mark a full written exam.

At a time when this industry is getting more complex we have "competent" persons schemes that make it legitimate to operate as an electrician with very little knowledge especially of older installations and rarely seen these days cable types (Pyro to name one)

236 came in parts A ( 1st year ) , B ( 2nd year ) and C ( optional 1 year Technicians course)
2360 ( introduced around 1990 ) came in parts 1 , 2 & 3 (C) , which is the course i completed at tech.
written exams for each year were indeed in 2 parts , 4-5 hours in total from what i can barely remember lol

The 2360 was introduced around 1978 / 9 part way through my apprenticeship so I ended up with an "A" cert, a "Part 2" cert and a "C" cert. To my knowledge they never turned the "C" cert into a Part 3. The "C" cert was killed off in 2006 or 7 as the pass rate had fallen too low for it to continue

 

[Sintra]

In my day the 2360 came in A), B), C). B and C i seem to remember came in as a single examination taken in two parts... Maybe someone here can verify that or not??
I would also state that the 2360 was superior to the 2330 that replaced it, but that's my opinion. lol!!


At least in those day's examinations were just that. No multiple choice questions then, all were set questions that you had to know and provide the calculations and/or descriptive answers to substantiate. I don't think i've ever sat an open book examination ever!! lol!! And another thing, in those early day's calculators were not allowed in the examination room either!!

You lot don't realise just how easy you have it these day's...lol!!

Why are the powers that be dumbing down our industry by doing away with all the proper qualifications. Personally I would like to see the standards maintained. Changing names / numbers of time honoured exams and making them easier is not the way to go. We need and should have high standards and with that goes a high rate of failure.