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"Hello All",

I am trying to find out some information to give to a Friend who is investigating the cause of Damp in his Home`s wall and has seen that his neighbours have Armoured cables entering their building through just a Hole / `Slot` in the Brickwork under ground level [Not visible at present but this is known] and wondered if the Hole in the Brickwork could be the entry point for the Damp to travel along the wall and then up into the Party wall into His property.


These Armoured cables are the Electricity supplies to 2 Flats - from the Meters / Main Fuses which are installed in an External Meter box to the Consumer Unit within each Flat - the cables run down the wall into the ground and bend through a Hole `Slot` into the Building.


I happen to know / remember that no Ducting was used through the Hole / `Slot` in the Brickwork where the cables enter the other building and the Hole / `Slot` was never made good before the trench for the new Electricity supply was filled in - as I was working at my Friends Home installing a Heating system when these cables were installed next door - I remember seeing how the Cables were installed and thinking that they should have been Ducted through the wall with the Ducting sealed at least externally.

At the time I remember that the bends on the Armoured cable would not have allowed any form of Ducting to be installed which would have run the full thickness of the Wall - I assumed that this is why none was installed.


Now that I have been asked by my Friend for advice on whether this Hole below the ground could be causing the Damp to permeate along the walls and up into the Party wall I would like to be able to let my Friend / his Neighbours know what should have been done when the Armoured cables were installed through the wall - in terms of a Duct an sealing the Duct to prevent the ingress of Water from the ground both into the Brickwork and through the Duct - ?

I am sceptical that this is the cause of the Damp in His next door property because of the amount of time that has elapsed [Years] before this Damp problem exhibited itself - but He has recently spent a fair bit of Money on Professional Damp treatments of the Walls in the area of the Damp and adjacent to it which has not solved the problem.

The Hole adjacent to the Cable entry point has not been excavated yet so I cannot post any Photos but I can still visualise what was done when they were installed.



I would like to be able to let Him know exactly what should have been done - or what can now be done to try and rule out or solve the Damp problem by Sealing the underground entry point of these Armoured cables into next doors Building - obviously ideally by being able to just Seal up the Hole / `Slot` with something that will NOT affect the Armoured cable sheathing - is this possible ?

Unfortunately there would be no way to correctly install any Duct
around the Cables because of the way that they bend through the `Slot` / Hole in the Brickwork.

It is not going to be an option for an Electrician to disconnect these cables in order for them to be bent to allow a Duct to be installed [even IF there is enough slack within the Ground Floor Flat to pull back enough cable ?] because the People who now own the Flats are Pensioners who definitely cannot afford to pay for that.

As You can imagine my Friend does not want to pay for anything more than carefully digging a Hole adjacent the wall / Cable entry point and hopefully using something to Seal the Hole `Slot` in the Brickwork - which He can do Himself - will that be possible ?

I did not want to tell Him to just make good with Prompt Cement / Waterproof Cement or even Sand & Cement Mortar in case this would be corrosive to the exterior sheathing of the Armoured cable - ?

Obviously because the Hole is under ground whatever is used would have to be Waterproof.


I would really appreciate your Help and Advice on this Please.


Regards,


Chris
 
Re: Armoured cable into building below ground - how should hole have been ducted / se

"Hello again Geordie Spark",

I don`t think that there would be too much of a problem getting Waterproof Cement - the Damp Proofing Contractor should be able to either supply this or recommend what to buy - BUT I needed to KNOW that this would not be corrosive to the Cable sheathing and would adhere to the sheathing itself before I can advise my Friend correctly

I felt that it would not be appropriate to apply Tape around the Cables where a Cement product would be contacting them as this would be a possible Water ingress point - ?


Thanks again.

Regards,

Chris

And this seems to be the stumbling block - none of us seem to be able to give a definitive answer !!!

I understand your frustration.
 
Re: Armoured cable into building below ground - how should hole have been ducted / se

Well from personal experience....replaced an exterior light recently on my gaffe - cabled in T+E through the wall, clearly tails left during construction, roughcasters in, light then installed.
Cable looked none the worse for wear, tested out alright and no signs of water penetration despite 40 years of scottish weather pounding away....
 
Re: Armoured cable into building below ground - how should hole have been ducted / se

Given the number of garages I've seen with the DNO's cable coming straight up through the concreted floor, I'd be happy to concrete/mortar it in. Anyway, isn't SWA suitable for direct burial in concrete?
 
Re: Armoured cable into building below ground - how should hole have been ducted / se

Given the number of garages I've seen with the DNO's cable coming straight up through the concreted floor, I'd be happy to concrete/mortar it in. Anyway, isn't SWA suitable for direct burial in concrete?


"Hello again HandySparks",

This is an example of why I posted my thread on here - to quote You:

`Anyway, isn't SWA suitable for direct burial in concrete?`


I need the answer to this please Members.

These cables were not installed by the Electricity Supplier - they run from the Meter Box into the Flats to the Consumer Units which were installed by an Electrical Contractor / Electrician.

The reason why I am persuing this is that I would NEVER give advice about anything that is not within my knowledge base without finding out the exact details about what I was going to speak about - which is why I `Asked the Experts` Tonight on here.

My Friend thinks that I am the `Font of all knowledge` regarding Building matters - although I might well guess a common sense approach to most things - with Electrical Installations / Electrical Materials I will always ASK Electricians / Electrical Engineers.


As You can see from the various messages Tonight this is NOT a situation where it would be financially justifiable that my Friend should have engaged an Electrician to give an opinion on this point after excavating a Hole adjacent to the cable entry point.

Regards,


Chris
 
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Re: Armoured cable into building below ground - how should hole have been ducted / se

cement, butyle mastic, CT1, proper long life outdoor rated silicon... anything along those lines really, just get the surface clean first.

I'd think there is a potential that this is the cause, and it could have taken this long to show up if the water table has risen / there's been a particularly wet period, or a leaking drain etc.

Often supposedly solid walls actually have a narrow cavity / rubble filled cavity before internal blockwork / cinder block, and any water can run along the cavity, so it's possible that water entering in one place can cause issues further down the wall.

Best to rule it out anyway for the sake of half an hours digging and a couple of quid's worth of sealant.

I'd still rate it as far more likely that the damp is actually down to condensation on a cold spot on the wall if it's not from a leaking drainpipe etc, as even if it did leak in in that way during exceptional rain, I doubt it's going to do it often enough to end up causing damp internally.


"Hello Gavin A",

Thanks very much for your reply and advice about the Mastic.

After the consencus about using Waterproof Cement and `Mastic` I was thinking about finding out about a `Long Life` / Immersible Mastic - I did have a quick look online but I did not find anything where One Tube could be obtained easily / without ordering.

The Damp is definitely not Condensation - not only has my Friend got a `Whole House Ventilation System` with Heat Recovery - but He also has the House Heating at a fairly High temperature setting on the Programmable Room Thermostat - when He was trying to Dry out the Damp patch He was using a Fan Heater aimed at the Wall - this was unsuccessful as the Damp is definitely coming up into the Wall from below the Floorboard level.


The Walls are definitely 9" Solid [plus Plaster above Floor level] with no seperation between the Bricks - I know as I have worked in His House installing Central Heating - and I saw the way that the `Slotted Hole` was cut out in the Wall next door that the Cables go through.
Regards,


Chris
 
Re: Armoured cable into building below ground - how should hole have been ducted / se

The PVC compounds used in modern SWA cable sheathing is pretty much immune to virtually all construction building materials. You can check that with any of the cable manufacturers, who will gladly highlight any chemical or compound that may cause any adverse effects.

I wouldn't use any weatherproofing/waterproofing material that contains Bitumen (especially if in permanent contact with wet or damp surroundings). It's old technology and far better longer lasting compounds are available these days.

Any damp proofing contractor worth his sort, your friend may engage should be able to give guarantees to any solutions and/or materials put forward, ....and don't just invite one to assess the problem, 2 or 3 will give you a far better idea of the underlying problem.... lol!!
 
Re: Armoured cable into building below ground - how should hole have been ducted / se

The PVC compounds used in modern SWA cable sheathing is pretty much immune to virtually all construction building materials. You can check that with any of the cable manufacturers, who will gladly highlight any chemical or compound that may cause any adverse effects.

I wouldn't use any weatherproofing/waterproofing material that contains Bitumen (especially if in permanent contact with wet or damp surroundings). It's old technology and far better longer lasting compounds are available these days.

Any damp proofing contractor worth his sort, your friend may engage should be able to give guarantees to any solutions and/or materials put forward, ....and don't just invite one to assess the problem, 2 or 3 will give you a far better idea of the underlying problem.... lol!!


"Hello Engineer54",

Thanks very much for your reply.

Because the Hole through the Brickwork is not on my Friends property this has now become more complicated than just finding out what to use to fill in the Hole with a compound / material which will not affect the Armoured cables sheathing.

When He contacted the Freeholders of the next door Building / Flats they supposedly sent out a Surveyor to look at the proximity of the Cables entering the Ground and therefore He was able to guess that the Hole through the Brickwork was immediately below that.

His opinion was that the `Hole was too far away from where the Damp is exhibiting on the External / Party wall junction for it to be causing the problem`[from memory less than a Metre].

Now that my Friend has decided that He wants to get the Ground excavated adjacent the cable entry point to look at this / the Brickwork surrounding the Hole the Freeholders are now being `Awkward` about this and have informed Him Today that they will want to investigate this for themselves - something that my Friend tried to get them to do Months ago.


I can obviously understand why the Freeholder wants to do this - they want to try and ensure that they are not held liable for expensive Damp proofing works and they should want the Sealing of the Hole done `Professionally`/ Correctly - but they had previously maintained without ever seeing the Cable entry Hole that it could NOT be causing the Damp to my Friends property.

They have also stated that if the Cable entry Hole is found NOT to be causing the Damp they will want to Invoice Him for these Investigation works and for the reinstatement of the Ground.


My opinion of this is that as they will be finding an underground Hole through the Brickwork into the Building which should NOT have been left like that - He / His Damp Proofing Contractors were entitled to suspect that it might have been the cause of the Damp in my Friends House.


This is now out of my Friends control - He will now NOT be excavating the Ground and Sealing up the Cable entry Hole / having Liquid DPC Injected around the Hole - although obviously this SHOULD be done by the Freeholders Builder / Damp Proofing Contractor.


So Thank You very much for your interest and information - and Thanks very much to all of the Members who responded to Me Yesterday / last Night - I really appreciate it.

Regards,


Chris
 
Re: Armoured cable into building below ground - how should hole have been ducted / se

I really can't RESIST "typing this post" in this STYLE.

I "apologise" Chris - it's nothing personal. Feel free to take the p*** out of ME also.

And I hope when I have a heating question you will still answer it :) :)

PS, it would have had more 'COLOURS' but my editor won't change colour for "SOME" reason.
Daz
 
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Re: Armoured cable into building below ground - how should hole have been ducted / se

I really can't RESIST "typing this post" in this STYLE.

I "apologise" Chris - it's nothing personal. Feel free to take the p*** out of ME also.

And I hope when I have a heating question you will still answer it :) :)

PS, it would have had more 'COLOURS' but my editor won't change colour for "SOME" reason.
Daz



Oh he will - he's a nice bloke - BUT there's No guarantee that he'll tell you ALL you need to know !! :rofl:
 

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