Bathroom wiring for elec toothbrush

[naylorpd]

I'm about to do wiring for a small apartment in Azerbaijan. Mostly I will try to use UK standards - ring mains with ELCBs, everywhere earthed, T&E cable etc.

I have a question for the bathroom - how do you safely put an outlet to power an electric toothbrush charger, fairly close to the hand basin? Do I need to use a shaver socket? If I recall, shaving sockets have isolating transformers inside?

There will also be a washing machine in the bathroom, also on an ELCB radial circuit (one socket) - could I extend from that, maybe fuse it down? Maybe hardwire the charger inside a fused outlet rather than a socket?

Thanks

 

[mattg4321]

Shaver socket suitable for charging toothbrushes (MK probably). Or look at Proofvision

 

[pc1966]

I had to search but found what you mean and it looks a neat solution:

Proofvision PV11P Toothbrush Charger White Twin | Toolstation

• In-wall dual toothbrush charger • Sits flush to the wall like a shaver socket • Eliminates trailing wires • Mounts a 47mm vertical metal back box • Compatible with Braun & Oral B electric toothbrushes (except iO series) • Bathroom safe with IP44 rating • Optional faceplates to match...

www.toolstation.com

I took the opposite apprach and just put a 13A plug on my charger so it can sit in the kitchen as needed, along with a handful of other phone chargers, etc.

 

[brianmoooore]

A hardwired washing machine to a FCU would be compliant under English regs, as long as the FCU is more than 600mm from a bath or shower. A socket would need to be at least 2.5m from the bath or shower.

 

[littlespark]

A hardwired washing machine to a FCU would be compliant under English regs, as long as the FCU is more than 600mm from a bath or shower. A socket would need to be at least 2.5m from the bath or shower.

It doesn’t have to be, as it’s in Azerbaijan…We would need to know their regulations if any.

And I think you’ll find it’s British regs… not English.

 

[brianmoooore]

Mostly I will try to use UK standards

It doesn’t have to be, as it’s in Azerbaijan

 

[littlespark]

So is it ok if I work in Britain to mostly azerbaijan standards?


No doubt bs7671 would be safer, and OP did say “mostly”… so there’s going to be some give and take.
Just don’t think spouting regs, distances etc is appropriate in this particular situation.

 

[naylorpd]

So is it ok if I work in Britain to mostly azerbaijan standards?

Definitely not recommended! Multi-strand cables, usually singles in a plastic pipe, often no earth, wires twisted together and wrapped with tape, usually only MCBs and lots of them, radial circuits...the list goes on.

For the guys doing the plastering, I put a small surface-mount DB with plug outlets, provided a properly wired Schuco extension lead - and they stuck two bare wires connected to a light bulb into the holes!

But the electrician I found was trained in a British-owned company and does understand the standards I'm looking for pretty well. So I hope to do a bit better than local standards.

The give & take that I have is that the washing machine is perhaps not quite 2.5m from the shower, but if I put the plug at the back it's near enough, and not in a direct line of spray.

I thought the Proofvision was a tad expensive, but I see that it has an isolation transformer on the back. If I can find one of those the right size I could make that for 1/4 the price.

 

[Lucien Nunes]

I appreciate this is off-topic for your question but I am intrigued as to why you would want to use the standards of a different country with incompatible parts. I appreciate that you want to achieve a high-quality, safe installation, but surely this means avoiding the bodges and dodges while retaining compatibility. For example:

Mostly I will try to use UK standards - ring mains with ELCBs,

Are you planning to use BS1363 sockets too? Or do you mean using a ring final with Schuko sockets? Schuko is a good design of plug and socket and I recommend it, but there's no point in using a ring final circuit with it. The ring final was designed to enable a 30 or 32A circuit to be wired with cable of lower rating, for convenience and economy. It's a clever system, as you can get away with a small number of circuits due to the increased diversity, but it is only suitable for use with our oddball fused plugs which have their own problems. 90% of the world doesn't use fused plugs, so they wire with 15, 16A or 20A radials instead which are more suitable in that case. They lose the diversity but gain the localisability and controllability of the larger number of circuits. Two different approaches, each with their own advantages.

You list some other characteristics but I am not sure what your point is, as some of them are equivalent or superior to UK practice. E.g. we also use stranded single cables in conduit in the UK, but only usually for commercial or industrial work. For domestic installations we use the cheaper unprotected T+E. Again partly this correlates with construction methods preferred in different countries. For buildings with hollow stud and drywall it's quick to throw in T+E (although later repair is much harder) but for all-masonry there is an advantage to flex conduit.

Obviously you can improve on twisted and taped joints, and circuits that could be earthed but are not; those are simply indicators of the minimum standards which customers will accept in that market. Why not get rid of those weak spots, add your RCBOs and whatever improved funtionality you want, but in general adhere to the local configuration?

 

[naylorpd]

Are you planning to use BS1363 sockets too?

Yes, I have MK sockets and switches left over from building my house. I'm more comfortable with fused plugs and they are better constructed than some of the local Schuko plugs. It's a one-time change for all the appliances.

I don't see any big advantage to flex conduit and singles, it's not as if you can pull another cable through later, once it has twisted and turned its way around the apartment and been buried in concrete and plaster. And not really any easier to thread three singles wires through than one T&E, which is what we are planning to do.

 

[Lucien Nunes]

I don't see any big advantage to flex conduit and singles, it's not as if you can pull another cable through later

It should be 100% possible if the conduit is installed correctly. Best practice is to complete the installation of the conduit system before starting to pull any cable in at all. If there are kinks and snags that prevent that approach, or a lack of drawing-in points, then the conduit is not being installed with adequate care, which is spoiling one of its advantages.

I'm more comfortable with fused plugs and they are better constructed than some of the local Schuko plugs.

No doubt there are cheap & nasty accessories on sale locally just as there are are cheap and nasty 13A plugs which I avoid like the plague. One can spec higher quality equipment than the locals generally use, without having to go to a completely different system. I actually rather like unfused plugs because they are more reliable and less prone to overheating on high loads. Try good quality examples of Schuko, NEMA 5-20, and BS1363 on a 3kW heater for an extended period and see which lasts better / maintains lower contact resistance / lower heat dissipation. OK, that's only one use-case and there are arguably situations where the ability to limit fault I²t is desirable, but once again there's no single system that has all the advantages.

I'm not trying to shoot down your approach, merely understand the motivation and offer my own outlook as a foil. I've worked in 18 countries and designed systems to meet very different and sometimes conflicting standards. Having spent hours testing and evaluating different brands of foreign wiring materials against both objective specs and to reach subjective verdicts, the general belief that many British sparks seem to espouse, that our equipment is superior in every important way, doesn't hold water.