Building Control Approval for Solar PV Installations

[Solus Direct]

Hi Everyone,

We are a Solar PV wholesaler in the Midlands and a lot of our customers are asking us whether they need Building control approval for all their Solar PV installations. This seems to be a bit of a grey area and some installers seem to do it and others don't.

Can anyone confirm whether this is a requirement of MCS and Building Control or not?

Thanks
Mark
Solus Direct

 

[VMan]

generally planning permission is not required but they do like to know what's going on. i just ring up the local council and tell them im doing a pv install, they put me throught to their planning department, then i tell them address and they give the ok.

if the roof is old / shot or property is old they may want to come out and check to see if you have made necessary precautions to make sure the roof can take the extra loading.


best always to ring and make sure.

 

[Solus Direct]

Hi,

Thanks for that. I am talking more Building Control approval rather than planning. Do you know whether actual Building Control certification is required part of MCS or by the Building control department. Some installers are submitting a building control application and getting each installation signed of by them.

I just wondered if there was a rule that says you have to get a Building Control Certficate for each installation?

Thanks
Mark
Solus Direct

 

[VMan]

I believe when you sign your job off through the competent persons scheme (Nic ect) they inform building control on your behalf, so effectively building control are informed of each job.

Perhaps if they are not member of a competent persons scheme they are going direct to building control?? don't know how the MCS would deal with this as they require you to be part of a Competent scheme?!?

 

[BruceB]

If you are registered under a MCS competent person scheme you can self certify for building regulations purposes through your certification body (ie NICEIC/NAPIT/ELECSA etc).
However, not all Building Control Bodies are up to date with the rules.
The answer is to have the Schedules to hand if you are ever challenged.
Worcester posted them a few weeks ago - I'll see if I can find them.
Regards
Bruce

 

[BruceB]

Can't find that original post but this is the meat of it:

Statutory Instrument 2010 No 2214 The Building Regulations 2010

See :
Items 17 and 20 of Schedule 3 [Regulations 12(6)(a) and 20(1)]
Self-certification Schemes and Exemptions from
Requirement to Give Building Notice or Deposit Full Plans

Here is a link:
The Building Regulations 2010

Regards
Bruce

 

[PVFIT]

Even in the event you refer them to Building Regulations some building control offices will still insist on you completing a building notice (the worst I've seen is a cost of around £300 for a scheme we completed in Northampton as they work on percentage of works value). I've argued that as MCS approved installers we should be able to sign off our own work - on consulting NAPIT they advised we must make building control aware of any intended installation, as well as querying planning, and they can apply the rules how they like as they take responsibility for buildings in the long run.

Another example is Vale of Glamorgan who asked us to complete an application form and pay £75 for priveledge of them visiting site on basis it's not just electrical works being carried out and they want to ensure the the roof structure can accommodate the additional live load/wind loads. When they attended site they had a quick look around and said everything was OK with our system being the first they had actually seen (despite our customer being aware of 3 others in their village)!

Other offices adopt a self-cert as our electricians are Part P - I think MCS and the certification bodies need to push for this approach across all councils

 

[Solus Direct]

Thanks everyone, you have been really helpful in clarifying this for us to pass on to our customers.

Mark
Solus Direct

 

[LABCman]

As someone on the BC side of things I would point out that your various inspecting bodies are not helpful in this respect generalling confirming that self-certification is restricted to the electrical side of the installation and that the structural capacity of the roof is outside the scope of the scheme. An application to a building control body is therefore necessary for the structural side of things. PV installations and the like apply point loads to roof timbers and they more cause undue stress, sometimes it will be necessary to seek a structural engineer's opinion before works proceeds.

Remember it is the responsibility of the person doing the work to comply with the regulations not the inspector which is why the courts will chase the electrician and not the building inspector.

 

[BruceB]

Well NAPIT and CORGI seem to have convinced my local BCBs that they cover all aspects of building regs and therefore their members can self certify. What legislative authority do BCBs have for trying to disapply the legislation cited above? Serial 17 of Schedule 3 of SI 2214/2010 does seem quite unequivocal that a building notice is not required for members of the competent person schemes run by the designated organisations.
Regards
Bruce

 

[SRE]

Latest from LABC - even though we use a structural engineer they still want their cash to check that he knows what he is doing, here's their comment:

Unless the CPS that you are operating in can be absolutely categorical and confident that all members in the scheme are 'competent' to assess the
structural aspects. Until LABC has that assurance I fear you will continue to be asked for applications. So I think it is in the interests of installers to lobby your
CPS to sort itself and its membership criteria out and then let us know what skills/qualifications installers have to meet to satisfy the self certification route.

 

[SRE]

Well NAPIT and CORGI seem to have convinced my local BCBs that they cover all aspects of building regs and therefore their members can self certify. What legislative authority do BCBs have for trying to disapply the legislation cited above? Serial 17 of Schedule 3 of SI 2214/2010 does seem quite unequivocal that a building notice is not required for members of the competent person schemes run by the designated organisations.
Regards
Bruce

Bruce - would you mind telling us what you have to do for Napit to prove competence for this? I'm not sure how much more than getting a fully qualified and insured structural engineer in anyone can do. If you're doing this for Napit and that meets their criteria then what's happening with NICEIC (who we're with) and Elecsa???

 

[BruceB]

It was not a big deal. As I had already been assessed by the same man for GSHP and ASHP he knew my systems were sound and as I have 2381 2391 MA CEng FIET he also knew my basic engineering knowledge and electrical knowledge was sound, so he was not challenging very hard on the engineering aspects. When examining the backup paperwork for one of my quotes he wanted to see what assessment I had made using BRE489 for windloading, that I had used the Schuco design guide correctly and that I had made an assessment of the strength of the roof timbers. The latter was pretty rough and ready using a visual assessment, TRADA tables and the 200lb man test. But frankly in discussion with the BCO that was all he was going to do anyway. I know you and Worcester are more rigorous than that. But I trust I would recognise a dodgy situation and get a specialist in.

As I have said before, I believe that as a result of this mess, our assessment on this part is likely to be more thorough next year for us all.

Regards
Bruce

 

[VMan]

I have been onto elecsa today , and explained the situation that some LABC are not accepting Nic's MCS accreditation for self certification of Part A (i think) Structural.
The Guy i spoke to assured me that we will be able to fully sign off the installs and they will inform building control on for us as they look to see if you have complied with Part A, Part C and Part P fully.

I'm interested to see hear if anyone has had any problems with building control and elecsa ( Hope Not ).

From now on i think we will use a structural engineer on all our installs as it is a minor cost compared to what the customer is outlying, and i'm sure they will appreciate the extra effort that out company goes to.

V

 

[SRE]

Thanks for sharing that Bruce - we had the BRE guide, we used SEN and Renusol and used their guides and had a structural engineer - all ok with NICEIC - just not good enough for LABC man!:death: