Can I swap my RTS timer for a Time switch instead of using a smart meter?

[Polfers]

Hi

Not an electrician, so would have a pro in to do this if its possible to do.

I have economy 7 for my heating and have brand new Quantum wi-fi enabled heaters: 3 X 1.5 KW 1 X 1.0 KW. Hot water is from bottled gas using Rinnai 55KW instant hot water boiler. Heating in bedrooms (3) and bathrooms (2) are by panel heaters with one heated towel rail.

I have an old style rotating disc meter connected to an RTS timer. I don't want a smart meter. I believe that before RTS, mechanical (Venner) time switches were used, and some of these are still in use, so those folks won't HAVE to move to smart meter. Question: is there a modern day equivelent means of replacing the RTS time unit with a sufficiently rated mechanical or electronic timer (or timer and suitably rated contactor unit), instead of a smart meter?

Thanks

 

[mainline]

Hi

Not an electrician, so would have a pro in to do this if its possible to do.

I have economy 7 for my heating and have brand new Quantum wi-fi enabled heaters: 3 X 1.5 KW 1 X 1.0 KW. Hot water is from bottled gas using Rinnai 55KW instant hot water boiler. Heating in bedrooms (3) and bathrooms (2) are by panel heaters with one heated towel rail.

I have an old style rotating disc meter connected to an RTS timer. I don't want a smart meter. I believe that before RTS, mechanical (Venner) time switches were used, and some of these are still in use, so those folks won't HAVE to move to smart meter. Question: is there a modern day equivelent means of replacing the RTS time unit with a sufficiently rated mechanical or electronic timer (or timer and suitably rated contactor unit), instead of a smart meter?

Thanks

There are lots din rail timers that could be fitted in a small enclosure along with a contactor to do what you want.

Why are you averse to having a smart meter ?

 

[snowhead]

No you can't use your own timeswitch as it's used to switch the rate in the meter so would have to be supplier approved, provided and sealed to stop / deter tampering.
And current energy suppliers don't use mechanical or electronic time switches.

I'm on a dual rate meter with built in RTS as I used to be on E.7,
I'm no longer on E.7 as I didn't use enough off peak to justify the extra cost on day rate, so I'm on a single rate with both readings combined by the supplier (no help to the O.P tho.)

Despite what my supplier(s) have been saying for the last 3 years or so my heating / power supply won't be affected when RTS is turned off next year, if they stick to this date, as my meter will just stay on a single meter reading.

I've just been ignoring the suggestions and prebooked appointments they keep sending saying that I must change to a "Smart" meter.
If there actually was a "Smart" meter I'd have one, but the ones they are fitting are nowwhere near Smart.
If they constantly changed suppliers to get the best rate hour by hour then I'd call that Smart.

Having worked with electricity for almost all my 51 year working life, (which finished around 7 years ago) I can tell when I'm using more or less of it.
I don't need an in home display to tell me, which if it breaks / fails after 12 months you the customer have to pay for a new one.

And the "Smart" gas meters are battery powered, were designed to last 10 years but have been regularly failing in less time than that, turning the gas off when they do fail.
The batteries cannot be changed on site, a new / refurbed gas meter has to be fitted.

 

[EricMark]

You are not required to have a smart meter, and also the supplier is not required to offer duel rates, the radio 4 long wave signal will stop when the valve fails as they are no longer made, so at that point any meters needing that signal will stop working, so you have to decide split tariff and smart or single tariff and non smart.

So the point is do you need a split tariff? @snowhead does not it seems need a smart meter, and I do see his point with the in home display, (IHD) mine in awake hours shows me nothing, it stays at zero all day, midnight unto 5 am it will show I am using power, but at around 4 kW any lamps or other items left on would not move the scale enough to see something left on, if I want to see use, I look at the solar panel web page, that shows solar, battery (charge discharge and level), consumption, and grid (import and export) so compared with that the IHD will show me when on a dull day the battery has run out, bit late by that point.

The smart meter app is at least a day behind, it does show how much it has cost per day, and a bar graph shows when used, so I can see when my wife had a shower, that is about the only item which uses over 5 kW which is the limit the inverter can supply, so it will raise the bar for that hour. And I have no intention of telling her showers must only be taken midnight to 5 am went my off peak ends. But we do set washing machine, tumble drier, and dishwashers to run over night.

So in your case with storage heaters you really have no option but to go for a smart meter, in the South (Line Liverpool to Hull) they work reasonably well, in the North they are replaced by another radio transmitter (South uses mobile phone network) and it seems there is a problem in the North.

But many, including me, did not realise there was a North/South divide with smart meters, so we hear cases of problems in the North and did not realise it is so different in the South until the panorama program.

But do you really have an option, with storage heaters it will cost a fortune on a single tariff, for me it was they will no longer pay for exported power without a smart meter, no law says you need one, but suppliers simply don't want to trust my export meter, and you can't blame them. And to have enough solar panels and batteries to satisfy all my needs, would be silly, so I need grid power, so may as well charge the batteries with off peak, I use around 15 kWh per day, of that around half is off-peak and half is solar, only on dull days do I use peak power. With the batteries moving around 5.5 kWh per day from off peak times to use during peak times. Monthly electric bill winter around the £60 mark.

 

[mainline]

No you can't use your own timeswitch as it's used to switch the rate in the meter so would have to be supplier approved, provided and sealed to stop / deter tampering.

What's wrong with him using his own time switch to switch on whatever he wants to have on or off at peak/off-peak times ?

He would be after the meter, so nothing to do with the suppliers or the suppliers seals.

 

[brianmoooore]

The RTS signal which switches his off peak appliances on and off can easily be replicated by a time switch and contactor, but the RTS signal also switches between the two dials on his meter, so without that signal he will no longer have a dual rate supply.