Caravan site wiring

[nickjohn]

Sorry about asking this question as I think similar posts have been made before but I could not find one along the same lines as this.

A friend of mine has a residential static caravan site (as in the caravans on the site are lived in 24/7 52 weeks a year by the same people).
The configuration of the site wiring is there is a central building incorporating the incoming mains which splits into individual meters for each van, this goes to a 60a sw fuse then into a 60A 30ma RCD then a swa sub main (with the old vans the swa went into the van and connected into a CU incorporating another 60A 30ma rcd and breakers) with the new vans the sparks has installed an external housing adjacent to the van which has a cu with a 60A 30ma rcd and 16A breaker, this then connects to an external 16A socket with a flex into the vans CU - the new vans cu has a 30ma RCD.

He says the vans must have a means of disconnection of the supply adjacent to them as they are mobile homes... some have to be lifted in with a crane so they are not mobile in the true sense of the word.. he also says the vans are limited to what they can use electrically wise as they are mobile homes hence the 16A breaker.

Now the problem is that as the vans are permanent residences they have washers / dryers / toaster / TV's / kettles etc etc which puts more load on them than say a holiday home.

My friend does not understand why we cannot just connect the swa direct into the van as they were before as the swa has an rcd at source which should give the protection necessary, also the small 16A breaker is already causing problems with the resident as it overloads all the time.

Can anyone shed any light on what is the correct connection configuration.

 

[GLENNSPARK]

I'd also be binning the two of the three RCDs wired in series to each caravan! The one at the mains intake and the one at the DB adjacent to the caravan! If a TT system then a type-s could be needed at the mains intake position.

Depending on the max demand at each caravan I'd be looking to feed the SWA into a two way IP rated enclosure directly adjacent to the unit with a 100A main switch and a 32/40A type b feeding a 63A commando socket.

so then why the 100A imcomer?

80 A will cut it Damian....it may be cheaper...or the same price for either...

 

[GLENNSPARK]

When a caravan (static or otherwise) is supplied/sold, it is tested and certified against section 721, the pitch is likewise certified against section 708, you then end up with a degree of overlap we are discussing.

Let me ask you a question, if someone brought to you (or your premises) a static caravan for you to provide an EICR for, would you pass it off with no RCD (no code) ?, bearing in mind you have no idea where it was to be used.

well....for a start if there was no RCD installed at time of manufacture/sale....then no fault protection would have been provided....

 

[nickjohn]

Thanks very much for the feedback, I think my friend needs to look at the whole site and how to handle future van upgrades and how they are wired etc.

Just another question whilst I was trawling the net looking for info there seemed to be a grey area as to when a caravan stops being a caravan, I noticed on a general caravan forum that if you have a static "home" and make it so that it cannot be simply moved (e.g build a porch on the side, build up the underside of the van so that it is fully enclosed, remove the wheels) then it stops being mobile and comes under different planning regs, would this in turn imply that the wiring regs would differ as well or would it still be seen as a mobile home..

 

[D Skelton]

so then why the 100A imcomer?

80 A will cut it Damian....it may be cheaper...or the same price for either...

I think I mistakenly said 100 main switch for outside unit and RCD as main switch for inside unit, should'a been the other way round. 63/80A 30mA RCD for outside IP enclosure feeding 63A commando socket. Replace RCD in the caravan unit with a 100A main switch. 100A is the bog standard type, that's the only reason.

 

[D Skelton]

Thanks very much for the feedback, I think my friend needs to look at the whole site and how to handle future van upgrades and how they are wired etc.

Just another question whilst I was trawling the net looking for info there seemed to be a grey area as to when a caravan stops being a caravan, I noticed on a general caravan forum that if you have a static "home" and make it so that it cannot be simply moved (e.g build a porch on the side, build up the underside of the van so that it is fully enclosed, remove the wheels) then it stops being mobile and comes under different planning regs, would this in turn imply that the wiring regs would differ as well or would it still be seen as a mobile home..

It is just as you said, a grey area. I don't think any of us on here are adequately trained on the ins and outs of exactly when a caravan stops being a caravan.

 

[richy3333]

Just to throw something else into the mix ESQCR needs to be considered and the issue of permanence (already touched on). To answer the OP last question. Around here, we have plenty of 'static' vans that people live in permanently. Some whilst building houses and some forever. Some have porches built on to them. Our DNO do not consider statics permanent regardless of how long people live in them and so have to be treated as 'caravans'. No earth is given and all have to be TT'd. Some of the local caravan sites have statics and these have to be TT'd also. The same applies to the C&CC site statics I've worked on - though they often have a 32A supply.

Someone mentioned the restriction of 16A on mobile hook-ups. Last summer I had a caravanner complain because their supply kept tripping out. They wanted a refund of the £2.50 per day they were paying for the electricity. The manager and I went to look, only to find they had 4 x 2KW heaters running (3 of which were in an awning), plus assorted other electrical appliances. The air turned blue with the managers comments (all understandable) and he asked the campers to leave!

 

[SirKit Breaker]

You can argue this point till the cows come home. It is well covered in the relevant part of BS7671,and that is what you will need to apply irrespective of your own ideas and opinions.

Get this wrong, and the consequences probably don't bear thinking about. You will be hung drawn and quartered if someone gets injured.

Cheers………………Howard

 

[spark 68]

Someone mentioned the restriction of 16A on mobile hook-ups.

Hi Richy,

I don't think anyone said the supply was restricted to 16A ?, just that 16A was the minimum allowed.

 

[GLENNSPARK]

the fact is:

just because it is considered a `static`...this does not mean that it cant be moved...at any time...

its just a case of getting a flatbed...and a winch to drag it on with...

so consequently the DNO are justified in considering them moveable/portable/not perminant structures....

 

[GLENNSPARK]

Hi Richy,

I don't think anyone said the supply was restricted to 16A ?, just that 16A was the minimum allowed.

more often than not its 16A thats available on caravan sites ....
this can pose a problem..

i had a cousin of mine wanting the supply `upgrading` on her caravan...

it took me several hours to explain to her i couldn`t just up the amps...

i think she sold that caravan anyway...once the novelty had worn off..

model citizens....

 

[spark 68]

Oh I know that Glenn, but you are not restricted to 16A for technical reasons, only by physical reasons and only what is available on a given site.

 

[Badged01]

Oh I know that Glenn, but you are not restricted to 16A for technical reasons, only by physical reasons and only what is available on a given site.

I reckon the sites are just tight ars*s! If they give you more than 16A you will use it with fancy electrical gadgets like kettles, toasters and heaters all on at once ...... or portable outdoor jacuzzis like I wish I had with my campervan!

 

[nickjohn]

So is the purpose of the plug / socket hook up purely for disconnection purposes should the van be moved at any time??

 

[nickjohn]

Sorry to bring this up again but if you have the 30ma protection at source of the swa could you get away with fitting a commander socket onto the swa then a plug / lead arrangement into the van (having a cu in the van with an rcd / breakers etc)???

 

[richy3333]

Sorry to bring this up again but if you have the 30ma protection at source of the swa could you get away with fitting a commander socket onto the swa then a plug / lead arrangement into the van (having a cu in the van with an rcd / breakers etc)???

Well, what do the Regs say...