confused about part P do i need it?

[Tiger]

part P started in 2005 and is only building regs, also they deemed at the same time to carry out electrical works on domestic dwellings you must be qualified to a minimum standard and belong to a organization such as NICEIC. Surely this can only be a good thing. Its a start, stop slagging it off. The reason why you get the bodging kitchen fitters is because they pay a lot of money for the fast track courses. This i think where the problem lies. If you complete the courses properly and are a proffesional responsible trades man then you would be more than capable to carry any domestic electricall works. I Personally think the NICEIC are quite strict on there domestic installer scheme and does eliminate your average idiot

hasel5

i agree,
i am a fully qualified spark with several years experience.
i am a member of the niceic as an approved contractor and also under their domestic installer status. i am not "qualified " by that scheme but approved to carry out all work in a domestic work in a dwelling without having to rope in the local building autority at 100 quid a go.
several colleges/training centres provide some sort of part p course which only really makes you aware of the regulations in place that are required when carrying out said works.if u ask me then no one apart from a qualified time spent spark should be working on electrics full stop. i have been called to many an example of the "part p qualified" kitchen fitter who has bodged some sockets in and documented the whole thing incorrectly. as for the 2391 qualification this is not a necesatity but highly reccomended for joining the scheme with the niceic. as long as you can demonstrate good working knowlage then this is deemed sufficient. sorry for the rant, hope this helps.

If thats the case he can't be NICEIC registered as there inspectors are quite good and will not let you join the scheme if your testing is not up to scratch. Maybe the kitchen fitter is a lying cowboy and your taring everyone with the same brush

 

[WarrenG]

NICEIC are no different to Napit, ECA or Elecsa as they are all government approved scheme's and all have Inspectors to inspect there members work and qualifications.

 

[Tiger]

NICEIC are no different to Napit, ECA or Elecsa as they are all government approved scheme's and all have Inspectors to inspect there members work and qualifications.

Sorry I didn't mean to imply they were, just using NICEIC as an example

 

[theskid]

I'm starting the 2391 in febuary. Because I'm looking for work, while on jobseekers, any course which is under 16 hrs a week is paid for by them. You can do your 2391 if you have your 16th edition but not your 17th. You have to take your certificate when you get inducted. Also part P is only for non qualified electricians who do minor electrics in their jobs such as kitchen fitters, gas engineers etc.

i rang my local college that do the 2391 up they said if i was unemployed i would not get any help what so ever.So your saying that you get it paid for if your claiming job seekers allowance?
And im only 16th edition,are you sure you can not take it if you have taken the 17th 3 day course,why would it make any difference?

 

[Spudnik]

You may find you would be helped if you have been signing on for 6 months or over.

 

[sparkyt]

part P started in 2005 and is only building regs, also they deemed at the same time to carry out electrical works on domestic dwellings you must be qualified to a minimum standard and belong to a organization such as NICEIC. Surely this can only be a good thing. Its a start, stop slagging it off. The reason why you get the bodging kitchen fitters is because they pay a lot of money for the fast track courses. This i think where the problem lies. If you complete the courses properly and are a proffesional responsible trades man then you would be more than capable to carry any domestic electricall works. I Personally think the NICEIC are quite strict on there domestic installer scheme and does eliminate your average idiot




If thats the case he can't be NICEIC registered as there inspectors are quite good and will not let you join the scheme if your testing is not up to scratch. Maybe the kitchen fitter is a lying cowboy and your taring everyone with the same brush

Tiger,

it was only last week i visited a job that had been carried out by an niceic domestic installer.(certs and reg number to prove) this was a new install to a kitchen extension, upgrade fuseboard and bonding etc. I was shocked to find what i did. where do i start.

all work designed, quoted and carried out after july 08

c/u replaced for the older style split board ie. m/s and 1 rcd- non 17th compliant-had noted on the cert "was designed before the 16th edition" !!!???

cerftification filled in incorrecctly, no mention of any existing circuits, just ones that had been installed new. readings for new ring didnt look very realistic.

tails from meter lashed around pipes and around other cable through the garage to the "new" c/u- approx 6m with no protection

all sockets/switches poorly terminated, copper expossed and a break in the ring. connections at switches arcing.

cooker point with skt rammed into a 25mm box - cables dammaged

new cable sheathed diagoanaly across the kitchen wall!!

all fire rated downlights cut in with incorrect holesaw-not one of them fits correctly.

all sockets different hight from worktops - result 5mm-45mm difference.

i didnt stick about to see much more. i was shocked, disgusted and most of all felt awfull having to explain to the customer, the defects to his "new" kitchen.

sadly this isnt the first of this kind of thing i have seen and dont expect it will b the last.

one further point- i disagree with the what u say about the inspectors.on my last inspection i wasnt asked for any up to date documentation, no proof i could still test or even that i was conversant wth the 17th. what am i paying all that money for?

sorry for the rant but had to be said

regards

 

[Tiger]

Rant away mate, you should report the fellow. I'am surprised about your inspector though, Mines **** hot everything has to be spot on even requires complaint procedures, health and safety, checks my public liability the works.

 

[dom85]

theskid, i ment if you have the 16th but not the 17th. i didnt mean you cant do it if you have the 17th.

jules hurley. electricians have to work in accordance with part p. we dont have to go and do a bulls**t part p course is what i was saying.

 

[Tiger]

Who ever signs it off has to have a part p to say it complies with building regs

 

[sparkyt]

Rant away mate, you should report the fellow. I'am surprised about your inspector though, Mines **** hot everything has to be spot on even requires complaint procedures, health and safety, checks my public liability the works.

i think i will be speakinng to the niceic regarding this installation, i get the impression that the original installer is just perhaps not competent enough to be carrying out electrical work as opposed to just being a rough a**e. the kind of things written on the cert were just bizare. it turns out that he had told the customer that he would be bringing his niceic inspector along to view the work on his annual review. shame he didnt.

 

[theskid]

theskid, i ment if you have the 16th but not the 17th. i didnt mean you cant do it if you have the 17th.

jules hurley. electricians have to work in accordance with part p. we dont have to go and do a bulls**t part p course is what i was saying.

Just want to know if i gave my job up to do 2391 which im only 16th editionwould it get paid for or do i have to be unemployed for over 6 months?How long have you been unemployed? DOM85
also would i get help with 17th if i was unemployed and did it after 2391 as not to go over 30 hours a week thing?