No, I don't think so, sorry.
No, I don't think so, sorry.
OP from what you've described, your faulty (possibly) cooker hood is tripping circuits 5 or 6, when logic suggests it should be tripping circuit 4, i.e. kitchen sockets? Unless the kitchen fitter, pinched a supply from the upstairs ring to feed the cooker hood?
Think the sparking hob thing is artistic licence, and too much wine when cooking
You could unplug your cooker hood temporarily, and see if that stops the fault.
Why don't you first try disconnecting the cooker hood by turning off at the wall switch you mention. This should be a double pole switch, which should electrically disconnect it from it's supply. If the fault not longer manifest itself, then you could start looking at having the appliance tested for faults.
This does not explain why the hood on circuit 4, is tripping circuits 5 & 6. Sometimes with the best or worse intentions, kitchen fitters deputise themselves as electricians, and can make a right hash of things, this of course is not true of all kitchen fitter electricians. If, as it already has been suggested, these circuits have been cross connected, may be one possible line of inspection.
I note that your fuse board is populated with MEM ALB321 mcb's. I don't believe you could purchase an MEM ALB321 RCBO (Residual Current Breaker with Overcurrent)? You can however, I'm told, convert them to an RCBO, using a field fit RCD Pod. MEM are no more, but spares are obtainable from EATON, well not spares but replacements. Clutching at straws, perhaps these kits have not be assembled as per manufacturers instructions?
You seem to have some confidence & trust in the electrician who originally rewired your property. Why don't you see if he/she will come back and investigate these faults?
It is difficult to carry out fault finding from afar. The label on your fuse board suggest you are due an inspection anyway.
Why don't you first try disconnecting the cooker hood by turning off at the wall switch you mention. This should be a double pole switch, which should electrically disconnect it from it's supply. If the fault not longer manifest itself, then you could start looking at having the appliance tested for faults.
This does not explain why the hood on circuit 4, is tripping circuits 5 & 6. Sometimes with the best or worse intentions, kitchen fitters deputise themselves as electricians, and can make a right hash of things, this of course is not true of all kitchen fitter electricians. If, as it already has been suggested, these circuits have been cross connected, may be one possible line of inspection.
I note that your fuse board is populated with MEM ALB321 mcb's. I don't believe you could purchase an MEM ALB321 RCBO (Residual Current Breaker with Overcurrent)? You can however, I'm told, convert them to an RCBO, using a field fit RCD Pod. MEM are no more, but spares are obtainable from EATON, well not spares but replacements. Clutching at straws, perhaps these kits have not be assembled as per manufacturers instructions?
You seem to have some confidence & trust in the electrician who originally rewired your property. Why don't you see if he/she will come back and investigate these faults?
It is difficult to carry out fault finding from afar. The label on your fuse board suggest you are due an inspection anyway.
Thanks, Midwest: all sound advice. I think I will get our original sparky back and run everyone's suggestions past him. I'm pretty sure he tested to make sure that the three circuits in question were properly independent of each other bu there might be something he hasn't thought of. You're quite right about an inspection being due too: I only noticed that when I posted the photo! Slightly embarrassing...
O
Octopus
You won't diagnose and fix this on a forum. You need a competent local spark with time, a mft and a clamp. Meter......
And money to pay them
P.s. I'm sure those are rcbo's
And money to pay them
P.s. I'm sure those are rcbo's
Fair comment. It's just that after having had 3 competent* local sparks draw blanks I thought I'd try a different tack for some input. Which I've got
* Though I guess some might measure competency by the ability to sort out the problem...!
O
Octopus
Is the trip random or cab you make it do it?
Because each circuit you have is individually protected by an RCBO an earth fault on one circuit cannot affect another circuit.
However it is slightly possible, especially as the board is quite old, that the RCD portion of perhaps both circuits 5 and 6 is becoming damaged and perhaps sensitive to voltage transients, which could be generated by the cooker hood and possibly by the ignitor.
I would more probably expect that the problem is more related to a fault on one or both of the socket circuits or weak RCDs.
A potential sense check might be to get an electrician to initially test if the RCBOs function correctly and secondly to swap the RCBOs between circuits and see if the fault follows the RCBO or not.
Obviously if the tripping remains with the RCBO then the RCBO should be changed, however it would have to be a secondhand one as they are no longer available.
If the fault does not follow the RCBO but remains with the circuit then the concentration should be on testing the circuits for, probably, neutral earth faults either internally to the circuit or between circuits 5 and 6.
However it is slightly possible, especially as the board is quite old, that the RCD portion of perhaps both circuits 5 and 6 is becoming damaged and perhaps sensitive to voltage transients, which could be generated by the cooker hood and possibly by the ignitor.
I would more probably expect that the problem is more related to a fault on one or both of the socket circuits or weak RCDs.
A potential sense check might be to get an electrician to initially test if the RCBOs function correctly and secondly to swap the RCBOs between circuits and see if the fault follows the RCBO or not.
Obviously if the tripping remains with the RCBO then the RCBO should be changed, however it would have to be a secondhand one as they are no longer available.
If the fault does not follow the RCBO but remains with the circuit then the concentration should be on testing the circuits for, probably, neutral earth faults either internally to the circuit or between circuits 5 and 6.
O
Octopus
so some match making - Tom are you in Oxford? Midwest - how close are you to Oxford?
Didn't spot that, need some new glasses!
D
davesparks
If it's two ring circuits then it's possible that someone got confused when connecting up the CU and interconnected two circuits, which would explain two rcbos tripping.
Yes, Midwest, are you within reach of Kidlington? I trust my original electrician but it would be good to get another pair of eyes to have a look...
More good stuff: thanks!
PM me if your original electrician can't assist. Bear in mind if the RCBO's are defective as Richard suggested, their replacements are about £80 each. Hopefully your electrician might just find a simple fault with the wiring.
Okay, will do, Midwest.
Sorry for slow reply. As the trip happens much less often than when we use the fan I've seen it as random, but some experimentation just now shows that I can make it happen most times that I switch from speed 1 to speed 2 on the fan, if I do it slowly. I got this idea from reading this other thread:
Cooker hood tripping RCBO - head scratcher - http://www.electriciansforums.co.uk/threads/cooker-hood-tripping-rcbo-head-scratcher.101736/page-2
...which I mostly don't follow (too technical for a layman like myself) but I get the drift that part of the problem was to do with something happening as the fan speed was changed. Our fan speed control is a slider, so switching between speeds means that you can have it momentarily between speeds as you move the slider along.
More information! Helpful or not, is the question?
O
Octopus
But you are reporting that a device on circuit A is tripping circuits B and C - which shouldn't happen.
Not sure what your point is, sorry...
The post that you linked to is describing a fault that trips the RCBO to which the circuit is connected. Your fault is tripping an unrelated RCBO so the fault resolution will be different.Not sure what your point is, sorry...
Though it is possible that the fault on the socket circuits allows the same effect to occur, just through a fault rather than directly on the circuit, but a bit unlikely.
Sure, I just thought any information might be useful. I was answering the question of whether I can repeat the fault at will. Even if the fault resolution is different, I thought the information about the fan speed adjustment might be helpful in working out why the fan causes anything to trip. To my (admittedly layman's) mind, why the fan causes a trip and why those particular circuits get tripped are the two elements of this puzzle.
O
Octopus
I think you should give up with internet advice and get your wallet out
Yes, I think you're probably right.
O
Octopus
^^ good man.
The best (and only) thing you can do is keep a log of what trips and when , and what you were doing........ then discuss this with the spark you get to investigate.....but don't be surprised if he "does the basics" to check what's connected to what etc....
The best (and only) thing you can do is keep a log of what trips and when , and what you were doing........ then discuss this with the spark you get to investigate.....but don't be surprised if he "does the basics" to check what's connected to what etc....
O
Octopus
Now that is carp
Crossed earths?
Ha ha I bet the sparking hob phenomenon is just coz whoever is looking at the hood is leaning against the knobs on the hob.... I've done that a few times fitting hoods and it scares the sh@t out of you for a second before making you laugh.
hello, here's a "way out there thought". If the ground and first floor sockets have any surge protection extension leads connected could the operation of the extractor hood cause a voltage transient that is causing the surge protection in the extension leads to dump the transient to earth and so operate the two rcbo's on circuits 5 and 6.
D
davesparks
Go on then, enlighten us as to what on earth you are talking about, or else I'm afraid I have to call -------- (bovine excrement) on this one.
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