Design 2396 Project - 2016

[Jake1992]

Hi people,

How did everyone find the test the other day ?
Any one started the project?

 

[JRspark]

That's handy to know then. Not sure if you have read the previous comments in the thread...but I have not yet started. I have 12 days at the end of May booked off work, to hit it hard as beginning of June, my tutor wants my first draft... the feedback I get from him, I can list on here. How are you finding the project so far??

Yeah with 12 days off you should be able to have a good go at it. When I first started it I was struggling on it but now I've added another DB things seem to be going alright with regards to grouping and volt drop. I work away all week so struggling to find the time!

 

[Jake1992]

Yeah with 12 days off you should be able to have a good go at it. When I first started it I was struggling on it but now I've added another DB things seem to be going alright with regards to grouping and volt drop. I work away all week so struggling to find the time!

Not all circuits have to be added to the grouping factor though (if they supply something under a certain amount of amps - don't ask me what, I havnt got my books on me haha) what circuits are struggling with voltdrops?? the lighting? as in my head I was going to install a klick system and increase the csa. Also, looking at the drawings, I wasn't going to have any rings, just stick to radials. Obviously im saying all these ideas, but not actually started the project and calculations, so my ideas might get flushed haha!

 

[JRspark]

Not all circuits have to be added to the grouping factor though (if they supply something under a certain amount of amps - don't ask me what, I havnt got my books on me haha) what circuits are struggling with voltdrops?? the lighting? as in my head I was going to install a klick system and increase the csa. Also, looking at the drawings, I wasn't going to have any rings, just stick to radials. Obviously im saying all these ideas, but not actually started the project and calculations, so my ideas might get flushed haha!

Yes your right if the cable is not expected to carry more than 30% of its grouped rated current it can be discounted from further grouping. Well so far I have only done the socket outlet circuits and desks, the length of run including all the drops eetc was pretty big if I took them from the original DB. Yeah I'm sticking to radials mate to keep it as simple as I can, I'm only a few hours into the project my self, got a full day on it Friday hopefully see some progress.

 

[Jake1992]

Yes your right if the cable is not expected to carry more than 30% of its grouped rated current it can be discounted from further grouping. Well so far I have only done the socket outlet circuits and desks, the length of run including all the drops eetc was pretty big if I took them from the original DB. Yeah I'm sticking to radials mate to keep it as simple as I can, I'm only a few hours into the project my self, got a full day on it Friday hopefully see some progress.

Drops? You running the cables in the ceiling void? not underground? - Where did you put your sub board? as if I was to put one in, im thinking on the pillar near reception desk

 

[GEOFF S]

Yes your right if the cable is not expected to carry more than 30% of its grouped rated current it can be discounted from further grouping. Well so far I have only done the socket outlet circuits and desks, the length of run including all the drops eetc was pretty big if I took them from the original DB. Yeah I'm sticking to radials mate to keep it as simple as I can, I'm only a few hours into the project my self, got a full day on it Friday hopefully see some progress.

Hi

Ring circuits have better volt drop capacity, just state an evenly distributed load and add a 0.25 factor to your volt drop equation, again for lighting if the load is pretty much evenly distributed, assuming a radial circuit use a factor of 0.5 in your volt drop equation.

Cheers

 

[Jake1992]

Just had my result back - Distinction ! - now just to wait till end of May for my time booked off - to start the project.

 

[Simonslimline]

Just had my result back - Distinction ! - now just to wait till end of May for my time booked off - to start the project.

Nice work. Bet thats a relief.

 

[JRspark]

Distinction for me too

 

[Jake1992]

Congratz people ! @Simons - big weight off my shoulders- I thought I scraped a pass. Cant wait to get stuck into the project now.. cant believe I haven't even started it yet

 

[Jake1992]

Started the project the other day, and got a few questions about random stuff that people might be able to help me on. Can we fix onto steel cladding (ceiling) ? some of my lights are high bay fittings (fittings I have found weigh 4kg)...and majority of the fittings do not line up with girders (as I was going to use the girder to hang from). The reason I ask if we can fix and hang from steel cladding is because when I had a look online, it seems pretty thin...has anyone had experience fixing and hanging lights from steel cladding? (exterior has a pvc membrane on the steel cladding- so drilling it wont make a hole for water to drip into) - another question that I asked my tutor but he hasn't replied yet is, when im adding grouping factors to containment - do I take the worse case and use that figure in my calcs ? (example - I have a run that passes through 3 different containment runs. one of the containment runs has 2 circuits in it, another containment has 3 circuits in it and the main containment "spine run" as such- has 6 circuits in it ... when working out my calcs, do I apply the Cg with the worse case containment?) I havnt come to working out calcs yet, im just making my routes...so I am aware that the 6 circuits wont all need to be added the calc, because a few of them have jack **** loading on them. Hope this paragraph makes sense cheers

 

[Andy78]

Fixing to the sheet roof will not be acceptable. If you span between girders/RSJs with a couple of lengths of unistrut you will gain more flexibility for positions to hang fittings from.

Yes the most onerous grouping factor applies with relevance to the installation method. Take note of table 4C1 for example and note that the value of Cg for 12 circuits for methods A to F is 0.45 but for method E is 0.72.

Note 9 under table 4C1 is very worth noting as you point out, and could be a reason for upping the size of cables to be able to include them in this clause. This reason would have to be noted in your project as the minimum calculated size for any circuit is expected to be used unless reasonably stated otherwise.

 

[GEOFF S]

Started the project the other day, and got a few questions about random stuff that people might be able to help me on. Can we fix onto steel cladding (ceiling) ? some of my lights are high bay fittings (fittings I have found weigh 4kg)...and majority of the fittings do not line up with girders (as I was going to use the girder to hang from). The reason I ask if we can fix and hang from steel cladding is because when I had a look online, it seems pretty thin...has anyone had experience fixing and hanging lights from steel cladding? (exterior has a pvc membrane on the steel cladding- so drilling it wont make a hole for water to drip into) - another question that I asked my tutor but he hasn't replied yet is, when im adding grouping factors to containment - do I take the worse case and use that figure in my calcs ? (example - I have a run that passes through 3 different containment runs. one of the containment runs has 2 circuits in it, another containment has 3 circuits in it and the main containment "spine run" as such- has 6 circuits in it ... when working out my calcs, do I apply the Cg with the worse case containment?) I havnt come to working out calcs yet, im just making my routes...so I am aware that the 6 circuits wont all need to be added the calc, because a few of them have jack **** loading on them. Hope this paragraph makes sense cheers

Hi

I Cg is always a contentious area, strictly speaking its only for cable of the same size and loading, there are methods, whether your lecturer and cg will accept them im not sure, that said 2.3.3 of appendix 4 will support . A simple formula is given in app 4 2.3.3.1.

Cheers

 

[Jake1992]

Thanks to you both for your replies - how do you guys think of this: between the steels - Im putting uni-strut from east to west of the building (fixed to the steel main frame) and using threaded rod to drop to lights. Only issue now is containment. I looked on uni-struts website - and have seen that you can buy lid to put on it to contain cables. Uni-strut with lid .... would I use ref method as trunking?

 

[GEOFF S]

Hi

I Cg is always a contentious area, strictly speaking its only for cable of the same size and loading, there are methods, whether your lecturer and cg will accept them im not sure, that said 2.3.3 of appendix 4 will support . A simple formula is given in app 4 2.3.3.1.

Cheers

Hi

Just to note, this statement refers to table 4C1

Cheers

 

[Jake1992]

Hi

Just to note, this statement refers to table 4C1

Cheers

Thankyou looked over that - very interesting read. What do you guys think about using uni-strut (With uni-strut PVC lid) as containment for FP200? And would I class the ref method as trunking?