EICR no RCD given a C2

[Robert51]

Hello,

I've recently had an EICR done on my residential let. The property is a 1-bed flat in London on the 8th floor, about 10 to 15 years old.

The EICR has not been issued but the electrcian has said as things stand, it is unsatisfactory with a C2 rating. This is due to the the fuse boxes did not have RCD for all the circuits in the flat (specifically the lighting and socket circuits). It has the older MCB instead. The electrician has recommended the boxes be changed to an RCD one which will cost about £600 or an RCBO for £750 in order for the EICR to be satisfactory and no other issues were observed and all the wiring were great.

I was slightly surprised by this. I've been reading up regulations since just to learn a bit more about what is required.

I completely do not mind remediating something that is required, however, I don't want to be taken for a ride and scared into installing something that is a nice to have. I have read that not having RCD is does not necessarily result in an unsatisfactory report but it's will result in a recommendation only to upgrade. What a C2 rating means is that it's not safe for continued use. However, if this is the case, surely most of the properties out there would fail the EICR which doesn't make sense to me especially given it's a new building.

I'm stuck between getting another electrician to do another EICR or not, however, I don't know enough to determine whether what the current electrician is saying is correct. I was charged £90 for the EICR.

Any advice here would be really appreciated!

Many thanks.

 

[mattg4321]

Occupied and 10 circuits I’d be around £250+vat

 

[pc1966]

They are occupied.

Best to discuss it with the occupiers so they know what is happening and why.

Gives them time to tidy and/or move personal stuff before some stranger is going through the house inspecting all sockets, light switches, etc, and so they know the power (and, horrors of horrors, the Wi-Fi!) will be off for some time.

 

[richy3333]

£90 and 45 minutes - bet he left the van running Theres no way that report is worth anything useful.

Total disgrace

 

[Taylortwocities]

. I asked around on MyBuilder and RatedPeople websites

That’s your problem, right there.
These are places where people pay money to advertise themselves. Any reviews can be their relatives, or themselves.

Would you say yes to a man in your local High Street carrying a sign saying
“I’m an electrician, I can inspect your electrics and give you a report”??

That is what these sites do.

You’ve thrown your money away.

 

[ChrisElectrical88]

Haha MyBuilder ?? £90 for 10 Circuits ???. £200+VAT minimum, absolute minimum for that It means it’s taken him all of 4.5 minutes per circuit. Absolute disgrace. Can’t wait to see the report
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Takes me 45 minutes to PAT test 10 items ?

 

[pc1966]

The growing problem for EICR is exactly like PAT testing: once it becomes big enough business due to legislation you get companies that "specialise" in doing it and it becomes a race to the bottom in terms of absolute minimum work for the fee the market will support.

No conscience. No professional integrity. Simply money from trained-monkey testers that are only there to do the one repetitive task.

When you look at the time spent the question should be "What did they check?" and in 45 minutes it is hard to see how they could even do the visual inspection of 10 circuit's worth of end points, let alone identify them, isolate, and do any useful testing.

 

[Robert51]

Hi everyone, I got the EICR back for one of the flats that failed it. I've attached a pdf.

If anyone here could let me know what they think of the C2 ratings in here, it would be much appreciated. As I mentioned before, I am just looking to see if these ratings are correct and proper or whether the guy is looking for more work.

Much appreciated everyone.

 

[ChrisElectrical88]

Did a child write that report up?

 

[mattg4321]

I assume it was written by someone who doesn’t speak English as a first language as there are numerous spelling mistakes and terrible grammar.

That in itself doesn’t make it a bad report.

On the face of it he’s managed to test an awful lot in 45 mins. Maybe he was there longer or had access to a previous report and has just copied that?

Some of the C2’s and C3’s are extremely harsh in my opinion.
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I personally would’ve definitely coded no RCD on lighting as C3. This requirement only came in with the 18th in 2018. Strangely enough he has coded C3 for cables buried in wall less than 50mm, yet this regulation has been around since the start of 17th edition. Makes no sense to me. This one is almost certainly far too harsh unless there are lights/fans within the bathroom zones or something.

No RCD on socket outlets in 8th floor flat would be C3 for me probably. No chance of using equipment out of doors. However this would depend on whether sockets were positioned in places I would consider greater risk/there being electric under floor heating on the circuit etc.

IP rating of light fittings out of bathroom zones is not usually a reason to code at all in my opinion.

I have no idea what he’s waffling on about when talking about NIC.

 

[Robert51]

I assume it was written by someone who doesn’t speak English as a first language as there are numerous spelling mistakes and terrible grammar.

That in itself doesn’t make it a bad report.

On the face of it he’s managed to test an awful lot in 45 mins. Maybe he was there longer or had access to a previous report and has just copied that?

Some of the C2’s and C3’s are extremely harsh in my opinion.
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I personally would’ve definitely coded no RCD on lighting as C3. This requirement only came in with the 18th in 2018. Strangely enough he has coded C3 for cables buried in wall less than 50mm, yet this regulation has been around since the start of 17th edition. Makes no sense to me. This one is almost certainly far too harsh unless there are lights/fans within the bathroom zones or something.

No RCD on socket outlets in 8th floor flat would be C3 for me probably. No chance of using equipment out of doors. However this would depend on whether sockets were positioned in places I would consider greater risk/there being electric under floor heating on the circuit etc.

IP rating of light fittings out of bathroom zones is not usually a reason to code at all in my opinion.

I have no idea what he’s waffling on about when talking about NIC.

Thank you Matt. The flat doesn't have any fancy under floor things like that. He did not have any access to previous reports at all.

On the topic of RCDs, how much would you guys charge here for fitting them onto a CU assuming things are in order.

 

[westward10]

He mentions a pike off consumer unit which I assume means off peak. This is not included in this Report and it should be it is part of the installation.
The problem here is there are no defined rules in BS7671 on how to Code issues just a mention in an Appendix that the lack of additional rcd protection should be a minimum Code 3. Coding therefore is down to personal opinion, weighing up the risks along with knowledge and experience should give sensible outcomes. Most people on here would not deem the Code 2 items in your Report as justifiable, unfortunately your electrician does.

 

[Strima]

Installation reference method is A which is cables run in conduit. A good assumption is that this is metallic conduit.

That would make the lack of RCD protection a C3.

Could you post a picture of the consumer unit (fusebox)?

Very harsh codings on that report.

 

[DefyG]

Were the multiple EICR's for similar properties? Thinking perhaps he did one 'properly' and used that as a template for others hence the 45min visit.
It took me longer than 45mins to get permission to switch off to get a Ze value on a recent EICR on a block of 24.
£90 is a joke for London especially 10 circuits, but maybe £120/hr is ok for London.
Mine would have been £245.00.(Berkshire not London) and 4-5 hrs!

 

[westward10]

He actually tested seven circuits, three of those single point circuits, the assumed off peak appears to have been omitted. Nevertheless if 45 minutes is an accurate timescale it isn't really feasible. This is a typical narrow minded Report with the usual comments rcd protection, plastic consumer unit and little else.

 

[SJD]

So all the circuits appear to have an insulation resistance test at 500V, but only (L+N) to E, since there would not have been time to go round and disconnect everything so should have been at 250V? That being the case, hopefully nothing plugged in or connected was blown up! Assuming the test was actually done!

I don't believe in 45 mins it would have been possible to do the range of tests on the sheet there are results for - such as all the (R1+R2) tests especially sockets.