Electrical safety diy

[lee sandland]

Hi all,
Went to the local DIY centre today and just had a look at the electrical depart ,and found a t&e 10mm cable suitable for a 10Kw shower ?? , Why would they be selling that?
So you’re doing a late job and you local wholesalers have closed ok B & Q ECT is open so I can nip down there.
A forum on here not so long ago suggest a ban of electrical product like this on sale to cowboy builder ect
So why not make it a law that yes they can sell these products but anyone who buys them must have been a scheme member and show there card at the till as proof.
Just an idea??

 

[jase]

The only truly dangerous thing ever done to my house electrics was done by a qualified NECEIC member who put the neutral for an RCD on the wrong Bus and mislabelled all the MCB's. Whats worse he then proceeded to test? the Installation and issue an EIC without owning anything more than a Socket tester and neon screwdriver. Did I bother reporting? no cos then I would get grief and more cost. Took me 10 mins to put right and 3 RCBO's to bring up to 17th


why not just do your own board in first place? lol and that EIC mayaswell be used as bog paper with no IR, continuity and Zs etc etc values on it

 

[jase]

What would work I think would be a system that says that anyone can do the actual wiring and it must be to regs. But they must not energise until signed off by a qualified inspector. This could be at 2 levels

1) Work done by competent person and fully self tested with written documentation. Low fee inspection. Basically visual with few key tests done. ie just signing off a proper sparcs work

2) Work done by non competent persons and not tested. Full Fee with full test and inspection.

s

Isnt this what the notification process is for? if i do a job being non registered as part P i notify building control, as i am deemed competent being a qualified electrican and i test my own work they sign it off based on my certs,
if i deemed non-competent they get someone of their own choosing to come and test inspect and certify my work, and if i am on a government approved scheme , i am assesed every year for competence and every notifiable job i do is logged with that scheme, but we all know people who are registered whose work is still questionable, you only have to do 1 good job a year to get assesed on and that gives you free reign to do what you want the rest of the time because you re registered???? how bout on the spot assesments seeing as every notifiable job is logged with the scheme you are on?

and that still doesnt stop joe bloggs going down to b&q and picking up his own materials to run in a new supply for his shower or whatever and not telling anyone what work he has done

 

[Madmole]

The only truly dangerous thing ever done to my house electrics was done by a qualified NECEIC member who put the neutral for an RCD on the wrong Bus and mislabelled all the MCB's. Whats worse he then proceeded to test? the Installation and issue an EIC without owning anything more than a Socket tester and neon screwdriver. Did I bother reporting? no cos then I would get grief and more cost. Took me 10 mins to put right and 3 RCBO's to bring up to 17th


why not just do your own board in first place? lol and that EIC mayaswell be used as bog paper with no IR, continuity and Zs etc etc values on it

Yep, our EIC doesnt have values for any of that on it!!! but the Council Inspector was happy with it and then signed off on the whole extension!

Dont worry. There is a new version with all the correct values completed now, done by me. But I'm NOT qualified or a member of a scheme! but I am Competent. As I'm only ever going to work on my house and maybe my parents, its not sensible to pay money to register (I spent it on a 1552!). I would either notify council (like I did when I added a new workshop and all its electriics) or just ignore the rules like most folks (As I did when I fitted RCBO's to all the light circuits and bonded the water supply)

But it strikes me that competancy isnt a requirment for scheme membership. Belonging to a company or paying money and showing a scheme examiner a finished piece of work, which may have been done by somebody other than you, is.

Its a shame that a few bad members spoil it for the majority of good electricians out there. Until the Schemes police them out, joe publics view of electricians will be diminished and they will continue to DIY

 

[Golden_Boy]

I am wondering just how many deaths / burns / other injuries are caused each year by electrical DIY jobs going wrong, As a percentage of the number of "major" jobs carried out by Joe Bloggs ( other DIYers are available LOL ). I am not an electrician but have never killed anyone or caused any other injury due to my DIY projects in the past. ( and none of my houses burned down either ) Neither did any of my plumbing jobs leak, nor did my house fall down when I installed a RSJ to hold up my upstairs walls.
With a lot of research and a bit of intelligence most jobs can be tackled quite easily. When you see the silly amounts some people are quoting no wonder there are more DIY jobs carried as a way of saving what ca be sometime a LOT of money.

G

 

[J@mes]

A JIB card would be the correct way to ensure that a purchaser is an Electrician. No reason why people should have to join expensive schemes - and what if they are an employee rather than company owner? They're hardly going to be a member of a scheme provider in their own right.

what if you don't have a JIB card but are an electrician?

I think it would be better to have to show a card relating to passing the 17th Edition - as this shows you can read the BRB and apply its regulations, and can therefore be accountable for your actions as "ignorance" would be no defence.

 

[Risteard]

what if you don't have a JIB card but are an electrician?

Then apply for one!

 

[Golden_Boy]

what if you don't have a JIB card but are an electrician?

I think it would be better to have to show a card relating to passing the 17th Edition - as this shows you can read the BRB and apply its regulations, and can therefore be accountable for your actions as "ignorance" would be no defence.

A JIB card would be the correct way to ensure that a purchaser is an Electrician. No reason why people should have to join expensive schemes - and what if they are an employee rather than company owner? They're hardly going to be a member of a scheme provider in their own right.

It would make no difference at all !!l As long as there are places like on-line auction sites, car boot sales and the likes there will always be a supply of "stuff" as long as there is a demand.........

I spent some time in australia ( when I where a lad ) and even though it is ILLEGAL for DIY ers to carry out electrical work there where places that would sell to Anyone with the cash........

 

[J@mes]

the HVAC business is about to bring in something similar with F-gas to prevent cowboys/DIY'ers and the uneducated from getting their hands on gasses which potentially poison the planet/ residents! Not sure if it will work though!

 

[Madmole]

You can buy car A/C regass canisters at Halfords, they work well. A DIYer even of he gets it totally wrong can only release maybe 1 small cans worth in a lifetime. The professional who gets blase will release many times that.

Professional or DIYer is irrelevent. There are skilled and unskilled within both groups. I am vehemently against anti DIY legislation (possible exception with gas). The legistation is normally nothing about safety and all about jobs for the boys. The car industry is now campaigning to make home car servicing illegal, yet my experiance is that they are much more of a risk than DIYers. Its funny, I run a large web site about a certain model of car (I'm just an amatuer) but I often get calls and emails from professional garages (even the manufacturers own) seeking advice

Knowledge and brains wins over paper certs any day

 

[martysparky]

I have not read much here but if there was a ban on sales to stop cowboys and as a DIYer can use LABC there maybe should be a license card to purchase obtainable from
1. scheme provider
2.LABC with a time limit for notified work.

surely although not completely that would make a reduction but surely they will make it cost us too...

 

[Madmole]

Ah, but its perfectly legal for DIYers and cowboys to do electrics and to buy stuff to do them

 

[martysparky]

yes its legal to buy stuff but not to do all work and in any case Part P says it should be checked by a qualified spark. so a license to carry out work card ( to buy electrical goods) would reduce DIY incompetence surely as they would have to go via LABC and be advised accordingly.

just a thought.