Ethics around EICR

[James]

Not sure about that James, if you found a C1 and did not inform the tenant, by way of an electrical danger notification, or temporary repair and informing the tenant, and then someone was hurt, I think you may well find yourself in court.

Tough one to call
You didn’t create the problem, only found it.
Your legal duty is to inform the customer promply

What law would you be breaking?

Like I said, we all make our own morel decisions

 

[7029 dave]

If I was selling a place and a potential buyer wanted an EICR done on their instruction and payment I would only consent on the condition that I had a copy of the report at the time it was done. I certainly expect anything that anything dangerous was reported to me ASAP in order to rectify and any other issues could then be factored into the price negotiation. I’d take exception to a last second ambush in order to get a price reduction. Easy to say, I know, as it depends on the amount of reduction being asked and how much the sale is needed, other parties in chain etc. Moral of story, get your own EICR done early days to save any surprises.

Why, that means you get a free report on the back end of your potential buyer who's paid for the report.

 

[westward10]

Tough one to call
You didn’t create the problem, only found it.
Your legal duty is to inform the customer promply

What law would you be breaking?

Like I said, we all make our own morel decisions

If you find a serious Code 1 issue who do you give the written notice to, the owner of the property or your client who currently has nothing to do with the property.

 

[andyb]

There is no tenant. It's current owner and prospective owner.

I was answering a hypothetical question Brian, again I was not addressing any particular situation.

 

[littlespark]

I think the unethical one is the buyer bringing up any faults just to get the price knocked down late in the day.

most buyers are happy with a home report, or buyers survey, which don’t go into the details of whether any services are working.

 

[James]

The purchaser is having it checked to ensure it’s safe to live in.
If it is deemed unsafe, they have a moral duty to tell the current owner.

The current owner has a duty of care to ensure the property is safe for tenants, guests, family, tradespeople to enter and do what they would expect to be able to do.
They also may have a legal duty to inform the buyer of any known issues

 

[7029 dave]

I remember when was selling my flat in the early ninety's, young girl looked at the flat, which led to an inspection report, the estate agent told me that they were coming round, the guy started his inspection, I let him get on with it, heard some banging in the bathroom he was taking the bath panel off, just went ahead without even asking permission.I went crazy throw him out the girl was waiting in the street. Phoned up the agents once I calmed down, telling them to take me of their books.

I did not get a copy of the report, didnt expect it neither.

 

[loz2754]

I was replying to this question Loz

'what's the correct course of action if you're doing an EICR for a non occupier i.e landlord/buyer and you fjnd C1s and C2s? Are you under any moral (or legal) obligation to tell the current occupants ?'

He mentions landlord. It's not a comment on his mate's situation.

Oops

 

[FatAlan]

Why, that means you get a free report on the back end of your potential buyer who's paid for the report.

Very true ?, but at the very least I'd expect some immediate feedback in respect of anything dangerous.

 

[Deleted account]

Ethically I think we have a duty to both inform the owner and give a copy to the owner.

however legally a accept we have been paid by one party only, therefore the report goes to them.

with the new landlord EICR laws the tennant is entitled to a copy of the report.

when I do these reports I do a copy for the landlord and agent and post a copy the the occupier of the address.

this question has made me think maybe I will in future post a copy to the home owner when doing a report for buyer. I don’t see why not.

 

[Julie.]

Ethically I think we have a duty to both inform the owner and give a copy to the owner.

however legally a accept we have been paid by one party only, therefore the report goes to them.

with the new landlord EICR laws the tennant is entitled to a copy of the report.

when I do these reports I do a copy for the landlord and agent and post a copy the the occupier of the address.

this question has made me think maybe I will in future post a copy to the home owner when doing a report for buyer. I don’t see why not.

It would be up to you of course, but you then would have provided data to third parties, which strictly, you do not own.

In the past I have worked for both the utility, and a consultant against each other in a legal battle. All the work I did for each party is privy to them, I could use my experience and knowledge, but the particulars obtained whilst doing the pieces of work I was contracted to do was confidential and the property of them.

Most contracts and implied contracts have a duty of confidentiality.

(Baring legal responsibilities etc)

 

[andyb]

It would be up to you of course, but you then would have provided data to third parties, which strictly, you do not own.

In the past I have worked for both the utility, and a consultant against each other in a legal battle. All the work I did for each party is privy to them, I could use my experience and knowledge, but the particulars obtained whilst doing the pieces of work I was contracted to do was confidential and the property of them.

Most contracts and implied contracts have a duty of confidentiality.

(Baring legal responsibilities etc)

This is an interesting point Julie, personally I think it comes down to copyright, ie, you commission me to undertake an electrical inspection of a property, obviously I’m contractually bound to issue a copy of the report to you, but who owns the copyright? My take would be that unless it was stipulated in a pre work contract the copyright would belong to me, so if I’m correct then I could give another copy to whoever I like.

Others here will have different experiences to me, but in all my years working I have never once issued or been asked to sign a pre inspection contract, so under those circumstances I would see the EICR as a publication commissioned by others and the copyright belongs to me unless I sign it away.

Be interesting to get other views.

 

[Julie.]

This is an interesting point Julie, personally I think it comes down to copyright, ie, you commission me to undertake an electrical inspection of a property, obviously I’m contractually bound to issue a copy of the report to you, but who owns the copyright? My take would be that unless it was stipulated in a pre work contract the copyright would belong to me, so if I’m correct then I could give another copy to whoever I like.

Others here will have different experiences to me, but in all my years working I have never once issued or been asked to sign a pre inspection contract, so under those circumstances I would see the EICR as a publication commissioned by others and the copyright belongs to me unless I sign it away.

Be interesting to get other views.

Confidentiality, copyright and IP are different things, as an employee the employer demands/owns all of these for the work you do whilst on their time.

As a consultant, Confidentiality is demanded by the customer, as is any privileged information within the work you do, copyright and IP is different as certain parts (e.g. style of the report etc) may be owned by you, but much of the content will be owned by the customer - often a contract will make this clear to clear up any ambiguity.

A contractor, as far as I understand is often considered as an employee in terms of these sort of things - i.e. all work done has been paid for specifically by the customer and they own everything, perhaps not as that isn't an area I know well, in terms of confidentiality it will always be with the customer. (it would be seen as a huge breach if you contracted for one party and then passed confidential to another.

Long time since I took advice on this, I generally work in line with the advice I was given then though; as a consultant the customer owns everything specific to their job, but I would own my style of reports/documentation/calculation methods etc.

In terms of an EICR I would see that as the confidential data and conclusions within the report are privileged, but the report format/boilerplate were mine - I would have thought similar for a contractor in this respect as you would already have the boilerplate and report format when you start.

 

[SparkySy]

I hate legal stuff it makes my head hurt, but as far as I'm concerned I have spent my time and knowledge to test and produce the test report, as such it belongs to me until the person ordering the work pays. Then it is theirs to do with as they please!
Personally if I found something that was potentially dangerous if I could fix it easily I would probably do it with consent of course. But it if not surely we have a duty of care to inform the tenant or owner of the property. I wouldn't be happy to leave something that may possibly injure or kill someone!

 

[Julie.]

I hate legal stuff it makes my head hurt, but as far as I'm concerned I have spent my time and knowledge to test and produce the test report, as such it belongs to me until the person ordering the work pays. Then it is theirs to do with as they please!
...

Agree, except you haven't spent your time on it, once they have paid, it's their time...

But yes that's my feeling, once they have paid for in (or are in the process of doing so) it's their property, not mine.