food for thought

[martysparky]

think you answered your own question there bro for it to be self sustaining you would need to condense the steam to return to the pot therefore cooled or introduce more water and a large pot of water takes a large energy to get it to boiling point i.e kettle

If the engine was in a sealed tank it would build up at the top and fall via gravity and would also remain hot ready for reuse.


people boil water everyday was suggesting about the energy costs of heating water in reference to the water of the device that would not be required to be boiled from an external source very often.


come on the light bulb is clear and bright....look again

 

[martysparky]

and too be honest we have vast amounts of natural energy ready too be harnessed at much greater efficiency so why not use that instead

this thread has really got me thinking though...................that we REAAALLY have too much time on our hands

but keep up the thinking for every 100 crazy ideas 1 might just work

absolutely on both accounts.

Is all that natural energy: wind, sea, water cycle, Earths spin, Earths orbit Perpetual Motion...
just a thought

 

[Doomed]

wind, sea and water cycle are powered by the sun, the earths spin was 'powered up' during the formation of the earth 4.6 billion years ago and is gradually using that energy, hence the length of a day is gradually increasing and the earths orbit is down to its mass balanced against the gravitational force of the sun which were both 'powered up' during the formation of our solar system and are once again slowly losing thier energy.
So no perpetual motion there then. Sorry.

 

[GStueyXR]

1st law of physics: Conservation of Energy

The law of conservation of energy is an empirical law of physics. It states that the total amount of energy in an isolated system remains constant over time (is said to be conserved over time). A consequence of this law is that energy can neither be created nor destroyed, it can only be transformed from one state to another. The only thing that can happen to energy in a closed system is that it can change form, for instance chemical energy can become kinetic energy.

 

[GStueyXR]

In practice, a steam engine exhausting the steam to atmosphere will have an efficiency (including the boiler) of 5%, but with the addition of a condenser the efficiency is greatly improved to 25% or better. A power station with exhaust reheat, etc. will achieve 30% efficiency.

So lets say you put 100KW in to the engnine, assuming you get a 100% efficient turbine (impossible) then you'll get 30KW out.

 

[GStueyXR]

wind, sea and water cycle are powered by the sun, the earths spin was 'powered up' during the formation of the earth 4.6 billion years ago and is gradually using that energy, hence the length of a day is gradually increasing and the earths orbit is down to its mass balanced against the gravitational force of the sun which were both 'powered up' during the formation of our solar system and are once again slowly losing thier energy.
So no perpetual motion there then. Sorry.

Conservation of angular momentum disagrees with this... The earth is not using or losing angular momentum, other gravitational forces acting on it are the only way its rate of spin or orbit will ever change. And whats more, the earth is forever accelerating, seeing as velocity is a vector quantity.

a = v²/r

 

[Doomed]

The rate of spin is definately slowing, coral fossil records and deposits in sandstone from the Jurassic period suggest a 22 hour day.
The acceleration I will bow to your knowledge on.

 

[martysparky]

1st law of physics: Conservation of Energy

The law of conservation of energy is an empirical law of physics. It states that the total amount of energy in an isolated system remains constant over time (is said to be conserved over time). A consequence of this law is that energy can neither be created nor destroyed, it can only be transformed from one state to another. The only thing that can happen to energy in a closed system is that it can change form, for instance chemical energy can become kinetic energy.

Confusion,

We are about to all start driving milk floats with hydrogen power coming on line.

we use electric to convert salt water into hydrogen then hydrogen to make electric.

given that most electric is still made from gas and only a small proportion is renewable wont that just displace one fossil fuel with that extra required from the power companies.

Will that really lower co2?

 

[martysparky]

The rate of spin is definately slowing, coral fossil records and deposits in sandstone from the Jurassic period suggest a 22 hour day.
The acceleration I will bow to your knowledge on.

hmmm interesting stuff.
The earth is moving away from the sun as the system expands widening the orbit. this at some point will start imploding and reversing. so a wider orbit means maybe, just a thought (logical I hope), that a wider longer orbit means extra speed to do the lap and maybe also as adjusting the revolutions (of Earth) speed aligning with it.

 

[martysparky]

wind, sea and water cycle are powered by the sun, the earths spin was 'powered up' during the formation of the earth 4.6 billion years ago and is gradually using that energy, hence the length of a day is gradually increasing and the earths orbit is down to its mass balanced against the gravitational force of the sun which were both 'powered up' during the formation of our solar system and are once again slowly losing thier energy.
So no perpetual motion there then. Sorry.

Any perpetual motion (man made concept) on earth will be gone when all that energy is gone but the wind, sea, etc are constantly moving as any man made machine could. when the wind, sea etc stop none of us will be here and I doubt if those machines would either so are they perpetual motion machines after all then.

Is that what you meant by impossible?

On that basis I reckon we are all living on a perpetual motion machine that is far more advanced than our inventions yet we have used energy from Earth in space ( taking energy from Earth) and we are still here that balance has not been corrupted. Or, would that failure of balance take place when such energy is take outside our solar system????

 

[GStueyXR]

Confusion,

We are about to all start driving milk floats with hydrogen power coming on line.

we use electric to convert salt water into hydrogen then hydrogen to make electric.

given that most electric is still made from gas and only a small proportion is renewable wont that just displace one fossil fuel with that extra required from the power companies.

Will that really lower co2?

But you are not converting energy by seperating the hydrogen.

The point I was making is that no method of converting energy is lossless, and definitely never gainful.

 

[martysparky]

Had a few too many last night me thinks this thread was started light heartedly, nevertheless, that machine shown on you tube was running its self and a lamp so that mus be a gain. Unless it was an illusion and blinded by the light.

 

[martysparky]

we have used energy from Earth in space ( taking energy from Earth) and we are still here that balance has not been corrupted.

we are constantly receiving incoming energy from the sun.

 

[GStueyXR]

Not to forget the mass/energy equivalence... Every spec of space dust puts more energy into the earths reserves.

 

[martysparky]

the question is, I suppose,whats it being used for or how could it be used?