Help settle a disagreement

[sparky05084]

Hey all.

Well not had the best of days today I tell you. Not only am I doing a full rewire on a ground floor flat (trunking city) but a colleague called today to have a look at my job (skive really) and he not only tried to show me up in front of the joiners by asking how long I'd been on the job (not the fastest spraky by any means but I think I've done ok), he also criticised my choice of positioning of bathroom extractor fan isolator and SELV unit.

Now, The extractor fan itself has been left in situ as it's relatively new and this is located in zone 2. Now, for convenience I have fitted the SELV transformer and isolator (it's an Envirovent fan kit so basically a dual surface accessory box with unswitched spur and transformer together) outside this zone on the far wall.

Now, correct me if I'm wrong but in order to meet the requirements one must install any SELV transformer or isolator outside the zones. Therefore, the position I chose to mount it at which is well beyond 0.6M from the edge of the bath is satisfactory. However, ask my colleague and I'm wrong.

I am told that I need to install the SELV kit outside the bathroom but this to me seems incorrect. Yes, I can see his point in that it's outside the bathroom so in terms of asthetics it probably looks better but I personally don't see any harm in where I have put it.

He is saying it needs to be moved and is saying not only it looks untidy but is in breach of the regs. I think he's just trying to have a pop at me but I wanted to run it past you guys just to see if I am right or should it be placed outside.

He then noticed I had run the 2 core flex (from SELV transformer to fan) in it's own trunking below shower load cable trunking route and told me I could run it together but I thought it should be seperate where possible.

Also (oh he hasn't finished yet) decided while he was on a roll that he would say the shower switch is in the wrong place (located to the left of door just as you walk in bathroom) and that it should be closer to the bath. It was originally right on the edge of zone 1 and you could physically operate the switch whilst being stood in the bath (not a shower unit by the way a shower over a bath if you get my drift).

I moved it as I don't think you should be able to do this and to be honest it looked stupid where it was.

So, is this guy just trying to wind me up or am I doing it wrong?

Cheers all.

 

[Richard Burns]

SELV transformer and isolator should be outside the zones.
ELV and LV cables can be run together if all insulated for highest voltage present or they should be separated.
Shower switch must be outside the zones, other than that personal preference.

 

[sparky05084]

Ok so that pretty much sounds like I'm ok and he is just making excuses to be unreasonable. With regard to the fan wiring (SELV fan load cable) I assume that I would have been ok to run the 2 core pvc flex with the shower T + E cable in the same trunking/

Forgive me if this is a daft question but how do you ascertain that the 2 core flex is insulated to the highest voltage band? Does this mean that as that 2 core flex could carry 230V also it could be run together?

Am I missing something?

 

[Des 56]

Other than agreeing with Richards comments,your own take on things seem more correct than your mates

Look in your on site guide on page 61,it has info on the one correct comment he made,(but did he know why?

)

 

[Richard Burns]

The voltage rating of the cable should be printed on it, if it is standard 2 core flex then it is probably 500V, so could be run with T&E.
Does this mean that as that 2 core flex could carry 230V also it could be run together?Yes

 

[sparky05084]

Thanks for the replies. Indeed sometimes one just has to apply common sense. Probably was OTT running it on it's own but was only a short route anyhow. Just another example for something for Mr. super spark to pull me on.

Honestly, sometimes there is just no need.

 

[Paul.M]

It seems to me that your supervisor is trying to make himself look big.

Ask your questions on here mate, look in the books for your answers and shoot the the little "C" down in flames.




I hate bullies by the way.

 

[sparky05084]

Cheers Paul. Yeah, to be honest mate he's not a supervisor but he probably wishes he was. A better term would be a stupidvisor. Likes to think he's "educating me". He doesn't even have his 2391 lol whereas I do. Not that makes me any better but still.

I think it's because my work is more methodical so he just wants to try to trip me up. Can't beat me at neatness so tries to make up by throwing curve balls and regs at me.

 

[Paul.M]

Cheers Paul. Yeah, to be honest mate he's not a supervisor but he probably wishes he was. A better term would be a stupidvisor. Likes to think he's "educating me". He doesn't even have his 2391 lol whereas I do. Not that makes me any better but still.

I think it's because my work is more methodical so he just wants to try to trip me up. Can't beat me at neatness so tries to make up by throwing curve balls and regs at me.

He is jealous of you simple as that. All he wants to do is put you down to make himself look good or make himself feel better than what he actually is.

Time for you to put your chin up, your chest out and shoot him down with regs and terminology (ask on here any time mate). I'm sure that a few thousand friends on the forum can help you out with this little "C", just post up your questions.



F me I really really hate bullies.

 

[Guest112]

have a read up in the bgb and osg and start quoting regs at him and not just quote but ask him if he knows them you seem to know what your doing and the shower isolator to me sounds spot on where you got it like you mentioned why would you want to operate it whilst being in the shower lol rise above it mate ive got a few like that in my firm the "oh i wouldnt do it like that" moany types or the saddacts as i call them

 

[Paul.M]

End of the day its down to the spec of the job, regs that we all abide to and then its your judgment. Simple as that.

If you can sleep at night knowing that you've done a great job and everyone is safe, what can this 'rounded door handle' tell you? Nothing. Get your bullets in order and shoot him down in flames.

 

[keefy]

Sounds like this guy is a complete arse. If you work for the same outfit you should be watching out for each other and advising, like the help you get here and not individual criticism. Tell him straight, he is not welcome to your job unless invited and his comments are unhelpful and should be kept to himself (you may want to add a few choice words in there too to put the point across more assertively). No one ever learns stuff from people like that, and let's face it you probably learnt more on this forum than you did from this work colleague!

 

[Guitarist]

According to 701.512.3 the (insulating) cord of a pull cord switch can be inside zones provided that the switch itself is outside, ie above 2.25m. Any mains ventilation equipment (extractor fan) that is rated at IPX4 or higher, and is approved for a particular zone as per manufacturers instructions, is permissible within zones 1 and 2. Also, any PELV or SELV equipment not exceeding 25v ac can be used inside zone 1 providing that the safety source is outside zones. It does not have to be outside the room.
If I am reading these regs incorrectly, feel free to tell me

 

[QSGAZ]

You should go to one of his jobs, take pictures and send them your boss, he sounds like a bully. If hes a work collegue he should have your back like i do with my engineers. dont get me wrong some time positive criticism is what is needed but it should be said in a professional manner.

 

[imago]

Hopefully I'm not in breach of forum rules? But my suggestion to remedy this sort of intrusion would be to wait until he next offers his opinion, and as soon as he opens his mouth crack him square in the lips.

Any other approach will unfortunately prove futile as you can't educate or reason with imbeciles. So don't waste your breath trying.