How do we make this job pay?

[trev]

That wont affect those sensible types trev, the non part p installers

Would they be the installers that part p was supposed to get rid of? Hehe

 

[3wayselectrical]

There's a little foot note to my rant! I quoted on a referb. recentley for a 4 bed 4 reception house. the work had been started by another sparks who had insalled the RM to the first floor and part of the first floor lighting and then bailed out claming he would not be available untill January for further work!

I quoted £4100 to complete the work including checking the work done so far and bearing in mind that the grounf floor lighting was mostley fire rated down lights. There were no left over materials apart from a few ends of cable reels and the materials alone came to £1500. I lost the job to someone who had quoted 'significantley cheeper'.

This morning I got a phone call from the 'customer' who had just paid their new 'electrician' for the completed job. As he was getting into his van he told her that she will need to get installation tested. The call was to ask me if I would be interested. I declinded as it was not in my interests to test and/or certify other poeples work, nor was I in a position to recomend any other electricians as I considered it unfair to place them in such a possition.

I know that some work is better than no work and that my responce may appear spitefull, but the legal implications of taking on the responcibility of unknown individuals work can lead to prison if it all goes wrong. Remember that it is your signature on the test cert. and if there is a fault not apparent in the electrical testing that causes damage, injury or death at any time in the future the insurance companies are going to come after you.

 

[malcolmsanford]

I went to price a kitchen rewire, another spark before me has already been to give a quote,

There is additions & alterations to the RFC
Water bonding
New cooker circuit
Alterations to lighting circuit
Core out for extractor

There is old rewireable fuse board, the customer agrees to a new dual RCD CU.
The first electrician has said already there's at least £300 just on changing your CU without touching anything else.

I know of this first electrician, he's an older chap who's fully registered and I'm sure knows his stuff and does a decent job issuing test certs and notification

A couple of days later i see his quote for £500 for the whole job, all materials and labour.

I can't compete at all with this! I'm getting this more and more lately and loosing out on jobs for people who are doing work for silly prices. I'd love to speak to this other sparks I'm loosing work to and ask them what there secret is? How do they do it?

Maybe you lot could tell me, is there some kind of electricians secret tool that allows you to first fix in an hour? Or maybe a special tool to help me second fix

That is something you younger lads will have to get use to, and sorry to say that when I do come home I will be the same as him.

He most likely does not have a mortgage, nor kids and will not need to buy new tools and will have got everything over the years.

He will not need the drimmels, or the fancy 36v SDS combo kit as time is not his driving factor, but the most important thing to a customer he is old, so therefore he must be experienced, must be trustworthy, must be sound.

So he is not needing nearly as much money to earn than a younger guy is needing. He will be quite happy getting 4 or 5 jobs a month that will cover his expenses such a scheme, insurance and virtually everything else will be pocket money.

 

[Welchyboy]

I find if you get recommended for the job you can generally make more money from it, if your getting work through advertising in the papers etc then you dont have that edge over anyone else who they ask to quote for the work

Most of all i find that first impressions and how you deal with a customer, how you present yourself and your business is what will be a decieding factor to winning the work, its a sales pitch like any other business, people mostly dont go for the cheapest quote all the time(you dont want work from these people anyway as they are normally problem clients), they will go for the best quote and with the person they feel they would trust and like
but obviously if your a few grand above everyone else then you probably aint gonna get the job either

 

[stan794]

Another knock back today - Wiring to new kitchen extension and new porch extension - New CU, 3 new lights, 2 external lights, 8 sockets, 2 mains fire alarms. The guy i am working with quoted her £700, she had a price for £490 blimey.

 

[Octopus]

There's a little foot note to my rant! I quoted on a referb. recentley for a 4 bed 4 reception house. the work had been started by another sparks who had insalled the RM to the first floor and part of the first floor lighting and then bailed out claming he would not be available untill January for further work!

I quoted £4100 to complete the work including checking the work done so far and bearing in mind that the grounf floor lighting was mostley fire rated down lights. There were no left over materials apart from a few ends of cable reels and the materials alone came to £1500. I lost the job to someone who had quoted 'significantley cheeper'.

This morning I got a phone call from the 'customer' who had just paid their new 'electrician' for the completed job. As he was getting into his van he told her that she will need to get installation tested. The call was to ask me if I would be interested. I declinded as it was not in my interests to test and/or certify other poeples work, nor was I in a position to recomend any other electricians as I considered it unfair to place them in such a possition.

I know that some work is better than no work and that my responce may appear spitefull, but the legal implications of taking on the responcibility of unknown individuals work can lead to prison if it all goes wrong. Remember that it is your signature on the test cert. and if there is a fault not apparent in the electrical testing that causes damage, injury or death at any time in the future the insurance companies are going to come after you.

Staggering.

Lately I've been showing "test, certification and notification too LABC" on my estimates to ensure that clients understand that its included. I normally "cover" this verbally when I talk through jobs so that if they are getting other quotes then at the very least its highlighted that its included.

 

[Short Circuit]

Another knock back today - Wiring to new kitchen extension and new porch extension - New CU, 3 new lights, 2 external lights, 8 sockets, 2 mains fire alarms. The guy i am working with quoted her £700, she had a price for £490 blimey.

i would've been around the same price as you - its getting worse isnt it! (has malcolm come back already :tounge_smile

 

[GLENNSPARK]

It isn`t just peter "pull it in" downt bar now guys....take a look in tesco, asda etc.....drums of cable,...various fronts,...sleeving and clips etc.....now everyone can be a "pull it in" peter for themselves so even the traditional "undercutters" are finding themselves undercut........wonder how long before dis boards, MCBs, RCDs etc grace the shelves?..once the stevie wonders have maxed out their credit at the wholesalers they`l be down`t supermarket (24 hours?) goin wild in`t isles...........

 

[Dcf]

FFs it is 1987.you take a good few years to get your rates to a decent level n now you get kiddie on prices like this takin you back 20 years.490 for that is not even a wage never mind allowing for any profit ,overheads etc.my mate has done work for a guy for about 10 year.boy phones him up and says" I've got a plumber for £18 an hour could u drop to the same to get the work?"we had a chat about this n I tell him no way if he wants you he pays you what you want not what he thinks he should pay.end result is he still does the boys work at his rates.the point is the plumber is never gona get above 18 quid with this guy. Ever. Try making money at level. Aye right.

 

[morph]

At the moment I'm lucky if i get 1 in 10 quotes converted into jobs. I've found the most successful approach on large jobs is to provide the customer with a bill of materials listing all the parts and costs, a scope of works with details of estimated man hours and a quote with the final costing. This seems to give the right impression to the customer and the most accurate from my point of view of how much I should be charging. On the whole I've been quoting around the £3500 mark for a typical re-wire on a 3 bed house (unoccupied,add about £1000 to an occupied because they never clear fernature or carpets and it always takes a lot longer). Working on my own a complete rewire is hard graft and usually takes about 2 weeks. I'm charging £150/day for that and getting under cut in some cases by more than £1000! How do they maintain a profit and keep up to date with registration fees and other overheads?

your pricing is not making sense you say its two weeks for a rewire at £150 a day so thats £1500 are you paying £2k for materials then
they maintain a profit by getting the maths right

 

[alarm man]

It isn`t just peter "pull it in" downt bar now guys....take a look in tesco, asda etc.....drums of cable,...various fronts,...sleeving and clips etc.....now everyone can be a "pull it in" peter for themselves so even the traditional "undercutters" are finding themselves undercut........wonder how long before dis boards, MCBs, RCDs etc grace the shelves?..once the stevie wonders have maxed out their credit at the wholesalers they`l be down`t supermarket (24 hours?) goin wild in`t isles...........

im not suprised,you have the people willing to work for free,why not get a few quid while you practice

 

[GLENNSPARK]

im not suprised,you have the people willing to work for free,why not get a few quid while you practice

My point is...ok right to free trade etc but if these supermarkets are selling these goods....dont you think they should at least be offering guidance notes on how to install these products properly?....I mean many people are ignorant of "safe zones" and correct cable sizes etc...and how many of them will be connecting cookers over 2KW on a ring?.............this is just basic stuff but my boss and i have seen examples of this type of thing quite a bit....it just isn`t compliant and if people shopping in these places genuinely dont know...................

 

[alarm man]

My point is...ok right to free trade etc but if these supermarkets are selling these goods....dont you think they should at least be offering guidance notes on how to install these products properly?..

the same could be said of those taking the money from those who think they will earn 50k in 5 weeks time for a crash course in being a spark...

 

[GLENNSPARK]

the same could be said of those taking the money from those who think they will earn 50k in 5 weeks time for a crash course in being a spark...

Agreed. I chose the apprenticeship route and feel i will be better for it. dont get me wrong....i`m all for folk trying to better themselves but its a case of "you signed the cert...you take the rap" and i think the ammendments to part p are long overdue......

 

[GLENNSPARK]

right....i`m off....6.00 am tomorrow.........